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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a great friend with a 17 month old who bites and hits my 21 month old on a regular basis. Each time they are together, something happens. Yesterday he bit my ds so hard on the hand that he broke the skin. Another time he bit him in the face about a half an inch away from his eye (We thought that K was kissing I, and it turned into a bite).<br><br>
Sometimes K starts off in a hug or just playing and all of a sudden bam. My friend removes him from the situation, firmly tells him (we don't bite/hit), and then she comforts him. What else can she do? Yesterday K bit my ds, repeatedly hit a 7 monht old baby over the head with a car, and started a hitting match witha 3 year old. My friend is very attentive and it seems as if it happens in that ONE minute when he is not being watched.<br><br>
Does anyone have some advice? I try to shadow my 21 month old when he is around K, but I have a 3 year old that needs attention as well. I really like my friend and her ds (when he is not hurting my ds), and I don't know what to do. I don't think it is right to keep putting my babe in this situation, but I don't want to stop being around my friend and her son.<br><br>
What to do. What to do...<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/confused.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Confused">:
 

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I don’t have any advice for you but I read your post and wanted to say that you seem very understanding and I hope you and your friends can work things out.
 

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Are you sure you aren't talking about my 17 month old?<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/orngbiggrin.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="orange big grin"><br>
It's funny, because my DD, who'll be four in Dec., has never hit or bit anyone in her entire life. She is the gentlest, most sensitive soul I know. But her brother.... wow! Watch out! He is sooo physical.... whether it's climbing up the front of our entertainment center (he scales it like a rock climbing wall<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/yikes.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="EEK!"> ), tackling his sister to the ground - who is twice as big as him, or biting, he's a real thrill seeker and, I believe, gets a tremendous rush from being such a little daredevil.<br>
Just yesterday, he bit his 20 month old friend on the side of the nose and almost drew blood! It seems as if the screaming and crying - very strong emotions - actually made him pleased with himself. A serious cause and effect, kwim? I've tried everything, and I know he will grow out of it, and until then, I have to keep as close an eye on him as possible. What's ironic, though, is that my DD and the 20 month old's big sister have been best friends since they were babies. The 20 mo.'s big sister used to bite and hit my DD ALL THE TIME! It's funny how quickly the mom forgot that her child used to do the same thing... worse than what my DS is doing right now!<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/yikes.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="EEK!">
 

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Have you tried positive reinforement when he isn't biting and ignoring that biting? I know it sounds nuts, but it sounds like he is doing it to get a reaction. So, by giving him the attention he seeks by praising him when he isn't biting will hopefully let him get the attention he wants without hurting others.<br><br>
You sound close to the mom and she sounds like she is trying to do what she can to stop the biting so I would talk with her about it and see if she wants to try it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">You sound close to the mom and she sounds like she is trying to do what she can to stop the biting so I would talk with her about it and see if she wants to try it.</td>
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She and I are very open with each other, so I will talk more with her about positive reinforcement. She does a bit of that . He's a bit like like candiland's ds, so my friend is rather tapped out from trying to keep her ds from injury and chasing after him. I try to help her, but I have two kids of my own and I am pregnant with dc#3.<br><br>
Yesterday, we all got together at a mutual friend's house and we all watched the author (her name escapes me) of Kid's Are Worth it give a talk via the VCR. Her ds left my kids alone, but I was on top of it the whole time. Her ds did start pushing and shaking another child. I tried to help by shadowing him for part of the time that we were all together. It's tough, because now the kids that know him seem to keep away from him, so it's hard to give the positive reinforcement when he is interacting with other kids.<br><br>
There is a 10 year old half brother involved (my friend's step son), so that makes things even harder. The 10 year brother likes wrestling and he spends 4-5 days a week at his mom's house. Apparently the boys were allowed to rough house together, but that has been stopped for some time. My friend knows that the dynamic between the two boys is part of all of this and she is trying to figure it all out.<br><br>
She's a really good mama and a loving soul, so I am trying to be patient with the situation. It's just very hard sometimes.
 

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My Ben (who will be five in a month) was a physical toddler, though he didn't bite. He pushed and hit, though. He still uses hands more than we'd like, but because we can reason with him it's a rare issue.<br><br>
When he did bite (only us--never another kid) at first we tried the whole, "no biting" in a firm voice, then comfort. We did that twice, then the third time we isolated him (in a room with a baby gate) for about 1 minute. It wasn't working. At one point I commented to a therapist friend about our strategy and she said that we were giving him two chances to bite--that we should consider picking him up, firmly saying "no biting", and IMMEDIATELY isolating him so that he could not get to us.<br><br>
THAT worked. The biting ended within a week or so.<br><br>
Fast forward a few years--Ben was on the RECEIVING end of the kind of biting/hitting you're describing, MamaOui. Ben has SCARS on his face from a fellow 3 year old at his preschool. This other kid went for the eyes, consistently--raked Ben's eyeball and scarred the bridge of his nose. He bit Ben near the eye--within 5 millimeters of the eyeball--and bit his nostril once as well. Sdly, his parents did nothing about it. The preschool teacher commented that children who directly go for the eyes, consistently, are often kids who have older sibs/kids around them who are aggressive with them, and they shift into survival mode. That was the case with this other kid. So it's learned behavior/survival behavior.<br><br>
But it sounds like your friend is tuned into that issue--there's a 10 year old who roughhoused with him. Is he in any day care or other care settings where he might have learned this?<br><br>
The only other recommendation is to see if it's something he does when he's over stimulated. Could it be that there's just too many kids there and it's overwhelming? Ben still gets overwhelmed by sudden crowds of kids.<br><br>
Best of luck--and a minor recommendation that she keep his nails clipped very short to minimize hurting other kids he might scratch. Ben's scar came from the other child's nails being quite long. The teacher peeled out a long string of Ben's skin from under the other kid's nails. (TMI? sorry...)
 

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<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">The only other recommendation is to see if it's something he does when he's over stimulated. Could it be that there's just too many kids there and it's overwhelming? Ben still gets overwhelmed by sudden crowds of kids.</td>
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ITA that this is worth consideration.<br><br>
My ds is 3, and for the past year I've been working terribly hard to teach him to "be nice" in various social situations. Can't say he's ever bitten anyone. But he screams, pushes, grabs, etc... I finally figured out that he doesn't even LIKE being with other kids for long periods of time. He needs TONS of alone time, or home time. He needs lots of 1:1 from me, and snuggling, and pleny of opportunity to explore toys and belongings by himself. THEN he can handle *short* periods of time with friends. Like -- an hour or less with high levels of supervision.<br><br>
My conclusion -- he's just not ready for a lot of highly stimulating social interaction. He needs quiet time at home with mom. For the past 4 weeks we have spent the majority of our time at home working on things together, and he is happier, more cheerful, more easy going, and sleeping better. He is also being nicer in the situations that we do see other kids.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Yesterday, my friend A and her son K were over. It seems like every time K goes near my son, Ivan, he tries to hurt him. K does not do it as much with my 3 year old, but my poor 21 month old got his hair pulled twice (a fist full) and the rest of the times A grabbed K in time.<br><br>
I don't know.<br><br>
So when we sat down to eat lunch Ivan just yelled across the table at him. He's just so frustrated and wants to be left alone.<br><br>
What do I do? this has been going on for six months and it does not seem to be getting any better. I am at the point where anytime K is within striking distance that I am nervous and I don't even want Ivan playing next to him, because 9 out 10 times it ends with Ivan being physical attacked. Not only is it not fair to Ivan to be subjected to physical injury, but I don't want him doing these things.<br><br>
Yes Ivan hits me when he's frustrated and I don't think it's all K. My dss have been known to get physical, but it's such a consistant, one sided behaviour issue that I don't know if I should suggest to my dear friend that we take a break for a while.<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad"><br><br>
I don't know. I am so conflicted.
 

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be understanding toward the baby and child with oral fixation. my daughter is that way--still at 7.<br><br>
i don't mean let them bite. i mean understand that some kids are way more mouth oriented. my son is not, so i see the difference.<br><br>
being with themm all the time is a lot, but an ounce of prevention......<br><br>
rrr
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
The thing is that we were both with them the WHOLE time yesterday and we usually are. And A gives K thirty seconds of leeway and boom something happens.<br><br>
It's not just biting. It's hair pulling, hitting, shoving, grabbing...Nothing oral about that.<br><br>
rrr, did either of your children consistantly target children that were their size or smaller and if so, how did the other child's parent react to it and what did you do?
 

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nak<br>
Hi, mamas. When my Will was under a year old, my best friend's son, several months older, would bite and also pinch and hit ds. We read a lot on the subject to cut it out, and within a few months, her son was no longer showing aggression towards my child. What worked on the biting was this: one of us closely shadowed her child at all times, and when he looked like he was about to bite, we would cup a hand under his chin and gently but firmly press his bottom jaw upward and hold his mouth closed for a second or two. And then we would distract him with something else to do. We would also give him something else to bite, maybe a cracker or a teether. Since this time, Will started biting me and I curbed it in a different way. Because I have noticed that he absolutelydoes not respond to prohibition, but will obey positive commands, I simply told him to "kiss mommy" and he would do that instead of biting me.<br>
Also, I have read that much biting stems from too complex of a social situation, and so I would agree with the suggestion of limiting the number of children playing together.<br><br>
HTH!
 
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