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My DS is 8 1/2 months right now. He got his 2 month shots when he was 4 months and his 4 month shots (minus the Prevnar) when he was 6 months. He did fine with all of them and never had any reactions. Now the time has come for more shots. The only problem is I don't have the money to cover them all (blushing and bowing my head in shame). He is scheduled for the DTaP, Prevnar, and HiB. Now my question is- if you HAD to get one for your child (yes, I realize almost all of you are anti-vax but I'm just asking a hypothetical question) which would it be and why? Which out of all of them are more of a concern for babies right now?<br><br>
Also, I think I'm going to refuse the chicken pox vaccine, as I really don't see the point in getting it. The MMR one I'm thinking of delaying. Can anyone point me in a direction to get more information on those 2? Thanks!<br><br>
Stephanie and Owen (10/03/03)
 

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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">The only problem is I don't have the money to cover them all (blushing and bowing my head in shame).</td>
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Don't be ashamed. Many of us watch our pennies and nickels. I can't afford things my children don't need either. Read thru this forum and you'll see that the cost of vaxes is constantly on the rise.<br><br>
I would not get another single vaccine for any disease. There is no such thing as "finishing the series". Read thru the stickies here and you'll gain much knowledge.
 

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I agree with Jen. I'm a SAHM and trust me, much of the time we are robbing Peter to pay Paul. It's not perfect, but it's important to us that I stay home with these kiddos.<br><br>
Anyway, I honestly would not get any of those vaccines. I would instead take the money and treat yourself to a yummy smoothie or something. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> If you are certain that you want to vaccinate, have you contacted the public health clinic? Most do vaccines for free or on a sliding scale. If Owen is breastfed, though, I would skip the shots. Chances of him contracting diptheria or tetanus at his age are miniscule. Prevnar is a very controversial vaccine that would be administered to my children after said children were pryed from my cold dead hands; but in many states there is a critical shortage. It may not even be available for you depending on where you are (I took dd to her 5 year physical this morning and saw a sign at the dr's office stating that Prevnar was unavailable). Hib is also not a big concern. Have you ever heard of somebody becoming ill or dying of Hib? Nope. You never heard of it until it was decided by the Powers that Be that it was a vaccine preventable illness and therefore every child in America should get the vaccine.<br><br>
Good luck with your decision. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> Our sons are two days apart, it is such a fun age.
 

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Hey Steph! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> I told you this when I was over there last week, but DTaP is the one the doctors push and push....it's also the one I'm positive Bran will not be getting anymore. I agree with the others...diptheria and tetnus aren't really a concern for the babies, and pertussis is part of the dtap that causes a lot of problems.<br><br>
I haven't heard of anyone dying from hib, but I have heard of people getting meningitis despite the vax.<br><br>
I agree with the chicken pox...there's no need for it.<br><br>
Prevnar...if it was THAT important, I'm sure the doctors would have found a way to avoid the shortage. That, and it is in shortage until 2006 because they are making a "safer" version...kinda makes me not want the "less safe" version, eh?<br><br>
I think there are a few threads in the archives that talk about the research of all of the vaccines...maybe you'll find some good info in there?
 

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First, do NOT feel bad because of the money. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"><br>
I too would choose none. I'm sorry, I know it isn't the answer you want but it is so horrible for me to think what shot I would choose if I "had to" get one. Because of my research I want NONE.<br><br>
However, I second the recommendation to call your health dept. I am sure you can get shots for free there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks Jen. I'm trying to read through everything but there's so much <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/bigeyes.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="bigeyes"><br><br>
Thanks Sasha_girl. Yes, Owen is breastfed <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/love.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="love"> I could get them free at the health department but I refuse to bring him there. I've heard horror stories including one from my mom when she brought my little sister there. She's never been back and made me promise not to bring Owen there either. At his last shots there wasn't any Prevnar for him but his Doctor said there would be some this time (but that was a couple months ago and things change so I don't know if there really is any this time). I guess I just haven't done enough research to make it okay, in my mind, to not do the vaccines. KWIM?<br><br>
Thanks Ally! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> Decisions decisions....<br><br>
Thanks annalily. I pretty much explained everything above but I wanted to ask is there a certain place where you found all this info on how horrible they are? I just don't even know where to start.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>StephandOwen</strong></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I guess I just haven't done enough research to make it okay, in my mind, to not do the vaccines. KWIM?</div>
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Just a teeny little thought...<br><br>
Shouldn't you do research IF you are going to do vaxes as well? I know I didn't, and once I did, I began wondering why I hadn't done the research before. I just took it as "something you had to do"....sorta like how circumcision, crib sleeping, disposable diapering, or bottle feeding if breastfeeding didn't work out.... If you still want to do vaxes, at least research would let you know why you want to, what a vax is made of, how it is made, and all of the possible effects (for example, my doctor NEVER told me that Bran could have gotten seizures or failure to thrive because of dtap....I had to find it on my own. He also never told me that reactions were fairly common).<br><br>
So, just saying, either choice you make, researching it is probably good. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"><br><br>
Ugh...I hate tough choices...Bran doesn't need vaxes until 12 months, and I'm still walking the line between delaying/selectively vaxing/or refusing vaxes...
 

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(I hope I didn't come off as mean... I just meant that it's a good idea to know what you're getting into, no matter what decision you end up making. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> Yeah, 24 hours isn't much time, but you can get a head start. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> )
 

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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">. I guess I just haven't done enough research to make it okay, in my mind, to not do the vaccines. KWIM?</td>
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I do kwim. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> Just remember that you don't have to vaccinate or not until you feel you can make an informed decision either way. At 8 months he's not at a huge risk for any of these illnesses, so a few weeks or so aren't going to put him in danger while you research. You can always have him vaccinated, but you can't take back having it done if you decide that it's not in his best interests.<br><br>
There's a cheat sheet (I think it's stickied) that is a wonderful resource. Here are some of my favorite websites:<br><br><a href="http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/mmwr_wk.html" target="_blank">http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/mmwr_wk.html</a> This is the CDC's Morbidity and Mortality report. All vaccine "preventable" diseases are listed, so check it out to see how at risk Owen is. Remember, too, that he is at an advantage since he's breastfed.<br><br><a href="http://www.909shot.com/" target="_blank">http://www.909shot.com/</a><br><a href="http://thinktwice.com/global.htm" target="_blank">http://thinktwice.com/global.htm</a><br><a href="http://www.vaccinationdebate.com/" target="_blank">http://www.vaccinationdebate.com/</a><br><a href="http:/vaccines.html" target="_blank">http://www.*********/vaccines.html</a><br><a href="http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm" target="_blank">http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm</a> This is Sherri's website. I took a vaccine class of hers and she is honestly one of my idols. There is SO much info on this site.<br><a href="http://www.cdc.gov/nip/publications/pink/Appendices/A/Excipient.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.cdc.gov/nip/publications/.../Excipient.pdf</a> This is a list from the CDC listing vaccine ingredients. It's an Adobe file.<br><a href="http:/vaccines/butler3.html" target="_blank">http://www.*********/vaccines/butler3.html</a> This is a link to some of Hilary's research. Tons of info here, too.<br><a href="http://www.hrsa.gov/osp/vicp/monthly_stats_post.htm" target="_blank">http://www.hrsa.gov/osp/vicp/monthly_stats_post.htm</a> This is from the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program. Lots of food for thought here.<br><br>
Anyway, hope this helps you. I'm not sure what state you're in, but you can also get on your state's official website and find out what infectious diseases are present in your community. My kids' pedi, for instance, tried to tell us that this, that, and the other were present in our community. A quick glance at indiana.gov showed us that he was lying through his teeth, as it's state law that infectious diseases must be reported to the government.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Yes, in theory I should have researched them all before he was even born. I didn't so he got the Hep B in the hospital. Time went by and I still didn't have the time so he got the 2 month shots. Then the 4 month ones. Just like I should have never left the decision to circ up to the a$$ wipe. But I did and yes, I regret it. I don't necessarily regret getting Owen circ'd but I regret not making it MY decision. KWIM?
 

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Steph, it's okay. We all have skeletons in our parental closets that we wish we hadn't done or had done differently. The important thing is that you find out what is best for Owen, not the community or his father or anyone else, and do it. It sounds like you are his only advocate, so it's important that you research things carefully (I know you will.) You can't change things that have been done in the past, but you can make sure that the future is better. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile">
 

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Why don't you reschedule the six month appointment?<br>
Just postpone for now while you research.<br><br>
You can read the MMWR that Shasha_girl linked, see which "vaccine preventable" disease he may actually be at risk for. Then research those diseases.<br>
It is very overwhelming! The sticky at this forum is exellent but does have a lot of stuff there. At least read through it once (I mean w/o reading all the links). Then go back and read a link or two from there or from Shasha_girl's short list.<br>
If you had the money I would recommend Sheri's class. She is awesome!<br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hippie.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hippie">
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Thanks for those links Sasha_girl! I've skimmed through a couple and found this....<br><br>
"There are other circumstances which may put a child at high risk of reacting to the pertussis vaccine but have been cited in the medical literature and reported by researchers and are not officially recognized by the AAP, the ACIP, and vaccine manufacturers. A good library, particularly a medical library at a community hospital or university, will give you access to the medical literature.<br><br>
Child is ill with anything including a runny nose, cough, ear infection, diarrhea, or has recently recovered from an illness.<br><br>
Several scientific articles have suggested that serious vaccine reactions are more likely to occur if children have current viral and bacterial infections. One article suggests that as long as "a four week interval between illness and vaccination may be advisable" and warns that while "it is a matter of clinical judgment how long the vaccine should be deferred….in administering the vaccines of any kind care should be taken to exclude the likelihood of infection in the child, his family, or other close contacts." The product information circular accompanying DPT vaccine manufactured by Connaught Laboratories in 1989 stated, "Immunization should be deferred during the course of any acute illness."'<br><br><a href="http://www.909shot.com/Diseases/whooping.htm" target="_blank">http://www.909shot.com/Diseases/whooping.htm</a><br><br>
That right there is enough of a reason for me to delay them a bit-- Owen's had a runny nose/cough/sneeze thing going on since last week (Ally knows all about that! LOL!). It's getting better but I'd rather wait *at least* the 4 weeks they suggest. That should give me plenty of time to do more research.<br><br>
So that gets me off the hook for now <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/winky.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Wink"><br><br>
I'm going to keep his appointment though because he hasn't had a check-up in a while and I have some concerns to talk to her about. Soooo.... thanks so much ladies! And a huge thanks for the links! I'm slowly making my way through them all!
 

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LOL...yeah, I know all about O's runny nose...Bran has that same one. Ugh.<br><br>
Yay for more time!!!!<br><br>
And I'm laughing about the @$$wipe thing...it took me a while to figure out you were talking about Owen's "father"....
 

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stephenandowen<br><br>
I would definitely reschedule your appointment. First of all your child is not feeling well and the running nose etc.. to me is enough to reschedule. I know that you are totally comfortable rescheduling because of that and by the way... <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/thumb.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="thumbs up"> for following your mommy instinct on that one..<br><br>
but I also want to make a case that when dc is feeling better ..I would still reschedule for a later date. I think you are still in the researching mode and with that in mind I would delay until you are ready to make your final decisions. Seriously, wait until you are comfortable because your son belongs to you not your doctor, not your friends, not anyone here at MDC but he's your son...so you have to do what feels right for you!<br><br>
by the way...this link maybe helpful...<br><br><a href="http://www.mothering.com/experts/tenpenny-archive.shtml#tetanus" target="_blank">http://www.mothering.com/experts/ten....shtml#tetanus</a><br><br>
good luck.
 

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Steph,<br><br>
The doc will try and tell you it's still ok to vax a kid with a cold just so you know. I have had docs tell me this and blindly I agreed and my dd reacted to prevnar <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad">.<br><br>
I don't want to scare you I just want to offer you a <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"> and don't be ashamed. I have been without insurance and without the money for a doc before.<br><br>
I didn't research at all and one of my kids was fine wrt reactions, had all his shots up to age 5 but now that I think back I really think he had pertussis anyway now that I know what it sounds like. Doc told me it was bronciolittis and now he is showing very strong signs of adhd, some people think that is connected to vax. But my 2nd child had a lot of reactions and she is no longer being vaxed and my youngest baby (a few weeks older than you Owen!) wasn't vaxed except for the hep b the nurse gave her in the hospital against my wishes. She is the healthiest of all of them at this age.<br><br>
Now it's totally up to you either way but according to the 2 peds I've had in the last 8 months both of them said the hib shot is the one they recommend the most even if I was forgoing all others. I don't know if that helps or not. Now IMO if Owen isn't in daycareand is bf which I noticed you said he is, then it's slim to none he is going to catch hib anyway. Bfing has a protective effect against hib.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Thanks Tracy and Jackie!<br><br>
Tracy- I took him in today. No shots and no next scheduled appointment (loooong story but basically he has no doctor because the state of MI screwed up and changed his medical insurance without telling me. now they're saying he can't go to the dr he's been going to since birth and that I have to take him to this different dr. But they never got off their butts and sent me the new insurance card and this new doctor won't see him until I have the new cards. ARGH! I planned to just stay at the first dr and pay out of pocket but was told today I couldn't do that because they would kick him off medicaid completely if they found out I was doing that. So no doctor to bug me about vaccines <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/wink1.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="wink1"> LOL!). Anyway, leaves me with time to research!<br><br>
Jackie- I told his doc he was just getting over a cold and she was cool with that, actually. She told me she wouldn't want him getting shots today anyway so just take him to the health department in a couple weeks to get them (which isn't going to happen for various reasons but I saw no harm in letting her believe I was taking him). And no, Owen isn't in day care (I have him with me all day) and is breastfed <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/love.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="love"> Well, I have lots of time to think about it now (see post to Tracy) <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/orngbiggrin.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="orange big grin"> Thanks for your post!
 
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