[Amalia65]

Hi everyone!

My name is Amalia and I am new to these fabulous boards. I've spent the last two days reading just a couple of forums...I'll be spending lots of time here...

I will be having my precious little boy at Swedish in late July. I have been battling with myself about the newborn procedures...Vit K shot and eye ointment. I still have to look into the PKU and thyroid tests.

Here's the thing...This little guy is my second child. My first, my precious Olivia was born still 3 days shy of her due date due to a cord accident. I was planning on having her at the Birthing Inn in Tacoma, with my midwives...no medication...just as natural as possible. I originally wanted to have a Home Birth, but our insurance would not cover that...so we opted to a birth center.

With this little guy, I opted for a different route. I had a WONDERFUL delivery with Olivia, and decided that what is most important to me this time is having a "LIVE" baby at the end of my pregnancy...and so I went with an OB at Swedish, who I really like by the way. So, as far as the delivery goes, I am all set...but I am very confused about all the procedures that will be done to "Speck" after his birth...I know that docs will instill the fear of God and death into you if you ask them about these procedures...so I was hoping you guys would tell me what you chose and or thought about them.

I do have genital Herpes, so the doctor will give me medication around 35 weeks to suppress any outbreak during labor, (I have very infrequent outbreaks...the last one was 2 years ago), but I agree that I need to take the medication. The eye drop is mainly for Gonorea, (sp) and Clamidia? Is that right? I don't have those, so I don't see the point in giving him the eye drops, unless it's also good against Herpes.

The Vitamin K shot has me the most worried. We are not circumcizing Speck, and the odds of him hemorraging just seem so FAR OUT there...plus the new studies about possible cancer linkage...I'm leaning towards declining this shot as well...but you know there is another part of me that is so afraid of this baby dying (sp) that I think, "Don't be a fool Amalia...what if he is born perfectly and then dies due to your declining a freaking shot!!!" I just can't think straight...

So any advice would be really appreciated.

Hugs and I look forward to getting to you know you WONDERFUL WOMEN!

Amalia

 

[kavamamakava]

Hi Amalia,
Have you contacted PALS? Many of the doulas around here are very familiar with Swedish. http://www.pals-doulas.org/finding%20a%20doula.htm
I do know that Swedish has a high c-sec rate but maybe that's because the high risk pregnancies are often monitored there. A doula will definitely help you navigate the procedures and gather information and be sensitive to your needs.

 

[shalena]

I tried to by-pass the eye goop and my midwives told me it was WA state law that my little guy recieved it...They gave me the option to opt out of everything else. Were they wrong or is this true?

 

[kavamamakava]

Yeah sure. The state requires it. But you have the right to refuse any and every medical procedure.

 

[shalena]

At least they put a very small amount in.

Sorry for hijacking the thread, I was just curious!

 

[memiles]

Yes, the eye goop is state law. My very crunchy midwife (who encouraged me to decline all other routine interventions) did say that declining it was a "red flag" to cps.

That being said, she wasn't very accurate with it's application, if you get my drift.....

 

[kamesennin]

Hi Amalia,
I'm so sorry about your daughter Olivia

, and I hope you have a wonderful birth for your next child!

I gave birth at a Birth Center, and I had 2 doulas (one took over because one had to leave early), and it was great having them there. A doula will help you keep your calm when things get rough and docs try to pressure you into doing something you don't really want (or need).

I don't know if eye ointment is necessary in your case, but I would definitely ask lots of people if you need it. We didn't do eye ointment or Vit K, because the baby looked really healthy. I had a short labor--12 hours after my water broke, and only pushed for an hour, so it was not traumatic for the baby at all. Her head looked ok and was not really molded that much, so we decided against the Vit K. I would have done it if I had a long pushing stage, or if there was a chance of hemmoraging from a traumatic birth.

Since you are not circing, I don't see why you would need Vit K! But, I suppose it is just a safety precaution. Sorry I am not much help, but hope you have a great birth!

Oh, and if you end up needing a c-section for some reason, definitely turn down the eye ointment! Baby wouldn't need that since they are not passing through the birth canal (unless of course you have to do it because of your medical condition).

 

[boongirl]

I thought this might provide some insight:

It is from the National Federation for the Blind

http://www.nfb.org/books/books1/ifblnd10.htm

Quote:

Ophthalmia Neonatorum: The well-chosen name of this disease means "inflammation in the eyes of the newborn." Once a dreaded and very common cause of blindness, it is now preventable by means of modern hygiene and medical care. Ophthalmia neonatorum appears soon after birth, but it is not hereditary. It is caused by the entrance of bacteria from the mother's birth canal into the baby's eyes. Inflammation appears in the eyelids and cornea and may spread further if not treated. Often the bacteria are those of gonorrhea, but other bacteria (such as staphylococcus) may be the cause as well. A successful treatment to prevent the development of this disease was discovered in 1880, and this treatment or its equivalent is now required by law. The eyelids of every newborn baby are cleansed, and drops of a silver nitrate solution (sometimes penicillin and other antibiotics) are put into the eyes. Effort is also directed, of course, to promoting good health on the part of the expectant mother so that she will not transmit harmful germs to her baby.

Also, you can go to here to find info on newborn screening tests and email them for more specifics about the laws.

http://www.doh.wa.gov/EHSPHL/PHL/Newborn/default.htm

 

[G&B'sMama]

I had my son in WA state and he did not have any eye ointment or vitamin K. He was not born in a hospital. I don't even remember the midwife offering, but we did talk about it during our initial interview, so perhaps she remembered that we didn't want anything unnecessary. My daughter was born in a hospital and she did get the eye goop and the vitamin K. Truthfully, I don't think that there were any long term ill effects from it. However, we chose not to do those things with our son because we wanted to have a long period of bonding where he was able to see as clearly as he was able. We didn't want it interrupted with painful or annoying procedures like injections, blood tests, bathing, etc. Our initial bonding time with our daughter was interrupted by all that stuff and after she was born I really felt a sense of loss about that.

But it is also my strongly held belief that pregnancy and birth is a natural and healthy part of life for most women and their babies. I was personally more afraid that something bad would happen to me or my baby in the hospital than out of it. Many of the hospital procedures are policies that must be set up to administer health care to the greatest number of people with the lowest risk to the hospital or doctor. This doesn't always mean that the policies are the best for my situation, but they may be just fine for someone else. If you are really afraid that skipping the vitamin k may result in some harm to the baby then don't skip it- the bonding time that is lost by those procedures in recoverable. I agree that working with a doula may help you make some of these decisions.

 

[Amalia65]

Thank you all for your input and thoughts. I will talk with my OB about it next week...but from what I understand now, at least about the eye ointment, is that it is policy/state law...so that if I want to deliver at Swedish, I will have to get the ointment...and I'm OK with that. I'm actually more worried about the Vit K shot, but after doing my research, I found that you can administer Vit K, IN MUCH SMALLER DOSES!!! orally...so I will see if this is an option.

Thanks again!

Amalia

 

[kamesennin]

You can also find out about getting an oral dosage of Vitamin K. I think this would be a good alternative rather than poking a baby with a needle right after it is born.

 

[Birth Junky]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amalia65 Thank you all for your input and thoughts. I will talk with my OB about it next week...but from what I understand now, at least about the eye ointment, is that it is policy/state law...so that if I want to deliver at Swedish, I will have to get the ointment...and I'm OK with that.

Just wanted to let you know that although the antibiotic ointment is required by Washington state law, you CAN ask that the hospital delay putting the ointment in to give you time to bond with your newborn while their vision is still clear.

A client of mine just had her baby by c-section at U of Wa Medical Center, and when they requested it the nurses waited on the ointment for 3.5 hours, so that mom and dad could have a nice long time to visit with the baby while she could still actually SEE them!

Good luck, and happy birthing!

 

[Amalia65]

Thanks Birth Junky!!! I will ask if they can do that for us!!!

Hugs,

Amalia

 

[kakirk]

I started a separate thread for this, but can anyone actually point out the specific law in the RCW which states that the eye ointment is mandatory??

Thanks,
Katie

 

[katt]

I have been looking for the law myself. I've heard that it is law in WA, but have yet to see it in actuality myself.

 

[TiredX2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Birth Junky Just wanted to let you know that although the antibiotic ointment is required by Washington state law, you CAN ask that the hospital delay putting the ointment in to give you time to bond with your newborn while their vision is still clear.

:

Just wanted to point out that the current AAP recommendation on Bfeeding includes:

Quote:

The alert, healthy newborn infant is capable of latching on to a breast without specific assistance within the first hour after birth. Dry the infant, assign Apgar scores, and perform the initial physical assessment while the infant is with the mother. The mother is an optimal heat source for the infant. Delay weighing, measuring, bathing, needle-sticks, and eye prophylaxis until after the first feeding is completed. Infants affected by maternal medications may require assistance for effective latch-on.Except under unusual circumstances, the newborn infant should remain with the mother throughout the recovery period

http://aappolicy.aappublications.org...rics;115/2/496

 

[TiredX2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kakirk I started a separate thread for this, but can anyone actually point out the specific law in the RCW which states that the eye ointment is mandatory?? Thanks, Katie

I've been looking.

Here is a midwife saying it is the law:

http://www.gentlebirth.org/Midwife/eyeointm.html

Quote:

Washington State Makes a Mockery of Informed Consent for Eye Ointment I am required by law to administer erythromycin to the NB's eyes. I made an informed consent sheet my clients could sign if they refused the treatment. When I was given a routine QA review by my malpractice ins they said I could not offer the informed consent. They said the only way I could not legally administer the treatment was to be physically impeded by the parents from doing so and then my obligation was to inform CPS of the incident. Needless to say, I quit offering the informed consent but I have not called CPS on any parents. I believe this to be a no win situation for me.

Here is a mention in a clinical studies database:

http://www.nei.nih.gov/neitrials/static/study19.asp

Quote:

In the State of Washington, one of three treatments is presently required by law to help prevent gonorrheal eye infection in newborn babies: 1 percent silver nitrate drops, erythromycin ointment, or tetracycline ointment. Although all three treatments appear to prevent eye infections from gonorrhea, silver nitrate and erythromycin may also partially prevent chlamydial conjunctivitis. However, silver nitrate may irritate and damage the eyes of newborns.

 

[arimama]

I had my son at swedish 3 years ago. I declined the eye drops and the nurse didnt make a big deal out of it. I didnt have to sign anything, I just told her that I didnt want it done.
But the next day the Ped came in and tried to pressure me into it. But I simply stated that I would not be doing it. period. While she was a little huffy, she didnt try to force it.

I would also recommend hiring a doula. Having had my own child at Swedish and having attended births there as a doula, I would say don't go in there without one

 

[arimama]

Birth junky
Why the heck would they bother with the eye drops after a c-section. Doesnt the potential risk come from the baby picking up an infection on the way out of the VAGINA?
ugh.