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I can't decide which is more damning about this ad campaign--The terrible analogy, or the picture of a child who should be rear-facing. :lol

http://mainevaxchoice.org/index.php...advertising-in-favor-of-mandatory-vaccination

Ginger Taylor's framing of the issue is slick and downright brilliant. The first paragraph provides a backdrop, and the second nails her point home.

Additionally, we would like to invite you to partner with our coalition in implementing a basic measure of protection for families in Maine who participate in the vaccine program, by creating a basic level of education for your physicians on vaccine injury per federal guidelines and manufacturer medical information. We would like the MMA to testify in support of our bill LD 1076, that would educate medical providers on this information, and provide a support system in the state for families with potential vaccine reactions to get proper evaluation, diagnosis, treatment and compensation via the federal Vaccine Injury Compensation Program.

Even if LD 1076 does not pass, the Maine Medical Association has the power to implement many of these programs on your own. The MCVC would be delighted to meet with you and provide information and experts who can help you begin to implement safety and support programs that would make much of this legislation unnecessary, and would begin restore trust in the vaccine program in Maine.
She later reported that those opposing LD1076 didn't even know the difference between VICP and VAERS. :duh

In other words, they didn't even know what they were opposing, (ummmmmmmmm, something "antivax," right?), and the very people trying to force parents into their exam rooms for counseling don't even know enough about vaccines to be counseling. :bang
 

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I can't decide which is more damning about this ad campaign--The terrible analogy, or the picture of a child who should be rear-facing. :lol

http://mainevaxchoice.org/index.php...advertising-in-favor-of-mandatory-vaccination

Ginger Taylor's framing of the issue is slick and downright brilliant. The first paragraph provides a backdrop, and the second nails her point home.

She later reported that those opposing LD1076 didn't even know the difference between VICP and VAERS. :duh

In other words, they didn't even know what they were opposing, (ummmmmmmmm, something "antivax," right?), and the very people trying to force parents into their exam rooms for counseling don't even know enough about vaccines to be counseling. :bang
Perhaps we can come up with a "law" on car-seat analogies and just give them an instant fail?

Besides, I know a fair number of non-vaxing or partially vaxing parents and all of them use car-seats appropriately. 0:)
 
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You are right vaccines aren't like car seats, it's a horrible analogy. If you chose not to use a car seat the only child you are likely to kill or injure is your own ;)

My semi-tonuge in cheek response aside, I am extremely pro-vax and I think this is dumb for other reasons as well. Medical issues are far too complex to be boiled down to a catchy picture and punch line. Sugar consumption is perfectly legal and yet all the data shows it's literally killing our kids...so why not make all added sugar illegal and start a campaign comparing car seats to organic, non-GMO foods?
 

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I'm going to mention the book Missing Microbes yet again. Overuse of antibiotics is drastically changing the human microbiome with deadly consequences--we need a good analogy for that one, too!

Perhaps a picture of a feed-lot next to a picture of an obese kid with the caption: "It isn't just the beef stock being fattened up."

And, as I keep saying, when it comes to behaviors that have bad effects on other people, over-use of antibiotics is killing 25,000 a year. The "anti-vaccine" "movement" hasn't even managed 100 deaths a year in the US, despite concerted efforts by the CDC and their friends to track down absolutely anything and everything that could be blamed/credited to this vilified group of evil troublemakers. I would be very happy if the CDC would turn their efforts and attentions to the big problems.
 

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I'm going to mention the book Missing Microbes yet again. Overuse of antibiotics is drastically changing the human microbiome with deadly consequences--we need a good analogy for that one, too!

Perhaps a picture of a feed-lot next to a picture of an obese kid with the caption: "It isn't just the beef stock being fattened up."

And, as I keep saying, when it comes to behaviors that have bad effects on other people, over-use of antibiotics is killing 25,000 a year. The "anti-vaccine" "movement" hasn't even managed 100 deaths a year in the US, despite concerted efforts by the CDC and their friends to track down absolutely anything and everything that could be blamed/credited to this vilified group of evil troublemakers. I would be very happy if the CDC would turn their efforts and attentions to the big problems.
On the overuse of antibiotics we can absolutely agree. It is a critically, critically dangerous phenomenon here in the US but especially abroad in countries like India where they are literally given out like candy. It is being taken seriously but I agree it should be taken even more so.

Im my Microbiology class we set up the agars with different antibiotic discs to test their efficacy against various bacteria and it's amazing how many are so narrowly-targeted. (They are mostly sorted by their efficacy against gram positive and gram negative bacterium, one that is "broad spectrum" targets both types.) The overuse of the broad spectrums is scary when there are so many narrower ones available. But, the broad spectrums are cheaper and work against everything so why not? You don't even have to isolate the actual bacteria you're treating!!!:):sarcasm::) And then there are the scary, lesser known bacteria like P. aeruginosa which is sensitive to virtually nothing and is the exact reason you can't bring plants into the ICU ;)

I am super pro-vax, pro-medical establishment obviously but my kids have had antibiotics exactly once, when they had strep throat/scarlet fever last year. Luckily they have a pediatrician who is super conservative with antibiotics, combined with a mom who has a healthy appreciation for what an (overused) miracle they are lol.
 

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Thanks, @sortacrispy. I think it is a tragedy that antibiotics are being overused both in medicine and in animal feed.

I think it is equally a tragedy that vaccine related illnesses are being overused to remove exemptions in a sort of "the sky is falling" approach to legislation, while the much more deadly problems of antibiotic over-use are not being addressed effectively in the US.

In addition to antibiotic resistance, the changes in the human microbiome are going to permanently damage the health and functioning of the entire human population.

I recommend that everyone read Missing Microbes. You can find it at your local library and if they don't have a copy, use interlibrary loan.
 

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On the overuse of antibiotics we can absolutely agree. It is a critically, critically dangerous phenomenon here in the US but especially abroad in countries like India where they are literally given out like candy. It is being taken seriously but I agree it should be taken even more so.

Im my Microbiology class we set up the agars with different antibiotic discs to test their efficacy against various bacteria and it's amazing how many are so narrowly-targeted. (They are mostly sorted by their efficacy against gram positive and gram negative bacterium, one that is "broad spectrum" targets both types.) The overuse of the broad spectrums is scary when there are so many narrower ones available. But, the broad spectrums are cheaper and work against everything so why not? You don't even have to isolate the actual bacteria you're treating!!!:):sarcasm::) And then there are the scary, lesser known bacteria like P. aeruginosa which is sensitive to virtually nothing and is the exact reason you can't bring plants into the ICU ;)

I am super pro-vax, pro-medical establishment obviously but my kids have had antibiotics exactly once, when they had strep throat/scarlet fever last year. Luckily they have a pediatrician who is super conservative with antibiotics, combined with a mom who has a healthy appreciation for what an (overused) miracle they are lol.
I agree. Antibiotic overuse is a HORRIBLE problem, and one I talk about frequently. I have a friend who went to an urgent care center with a sore throat recently. He had a negative rapid strep test, and they have him antibiotics anyway, because they still thought it might be strep. WTF? (His non-rapid strep test also later turned out negative).
 

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Thanks, @sortacrispy. I think it is a tragedy that antibiotics are being overused both in medicine and in animal feed.

I think it is equally a tragedy that vaccine related illnesses are being overused to remove exemptions in a sort of "the sky is falling" approach to legislation, while the much more deadly problems of antibiotic over-use are not being addressed effectively in the US.

In addition to antibiotic resistance, the changes in the human microbiome are going to permanently damage the health and functioning of the entire human population.

I recommend that everyone read Missing Microbes. You can find it at your local library and if they don't have a copy, use interlibrary loan.
Yes I think we absolutely should be trying to increase vaccination rates, but I would have liked to have seen a 5-10 year education plan implemented statewide before any kind of legislation was considered. I imagine if approached with facts about vaccine safety in a non-judgemental way a great majority of people would have decided to vaccinate anyway. I fear rushing to legislation creates even more of an us vs them mentality that entrenches people deeper in their positions and disallows real conversation to take place.
 

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Yes I think we absolutely should be trying to increase vaccination rates, but I would have liked to have seen a 5-10 year education plan implemented statewide before any kind of legislation was considered. I imagine if approached with facts about vaccine safety in a non-judgemental way a great majority of people would have decided to vaccinate anyway. I fear rushing to legislation creates even more of an us vs them mentality that entrenches people deeper in their positions and disallows real conversation to take place.
So why do you think the rush to legislation? I've been closely watching this process for several years, and I began to see justifications for removing exemptions and plans being developed for legislation as early as 2007. And that is just the public material, there could have been some discussions going earlier than that within the CDC and the AAP and so on. Which would mean it isn't really a rush, but a well-laid plan. Odd.

I know in Vermont, where I've been deeply involved in the process in the legislature, that both rounds of legislation involved carefully organized misinformation for both legislators and the public about vaccination rates and exemptions. In the second round, by shoving the legislation through at the last possible moment, the pushers were able to prevent accurate information about vaccination rates and exemptions from being shared with legislators. That seemed carefully orchestrated, too.

The public side shows a rush. The not so public side shows some careful planning.

The part I continue to wonder about is why. Vaccination rates aren't actually low enough to constitute an emergency and a lot of the gaps are due to ineffective vaccine delivery rather than vaccine refusal. Just improving vaccine delivery to babies and toddlers would work wonders for vaccination rates.

Why the urgency? What might happen in the next four or five years if Americans have exemptions available?
 

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Yes I think we absolutely should be trying to increase vaccination rates, but I would have liked to have seen a 5-10 year education plan implemented statewide before any kind of legislation was considered. I imagine if approached with facts about vaccine safety in a non-judgemental way a great majority of people would have decided to vaccinate anyway. I fear rushing to legislation creates even more of an us vs them mentality that entrenches people deeper in their positions and disallows real conversation to take place.

You might be wrong.


Skeptics, blogs, posters on forums and mainstream media have all been singing the pro-vax "you are misinformed" song for years. Some are polite and non-judgmental, but some are not. The one thing that has not been tried, AFAIK, is doctors talking about infant vaccines during pregnancy or devoting decent amounts of time to visits so parents can get their questions answered.


I know vaccine rates are high - upward of 95% in many areas for most diseases. The remaining 5% who do not vax or vax very selectively are unlikely to be swayed by different information. Indeed, there are studies that show this and that when it comes to knowledge on vaccines, sel/del are the most knowledgeable, followed by non-vaxxers and last come those who vaccinate.


My opinion is that the powers that be think they tried to convince non-vaxxers to vaccinate (not sure this is true), have decided they can't (this is almost certainly true) and instead of going: oh, ok, we disagree but you are the parent and free to make medical decisions for your child, have decided to coerce parents into vaccinating by numerous means, such as creating social pariahs, less access to doctors, strict or impossible to get school exemptions, etc.
 

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I'm still not sure why one would think a 2.45% unvaccinated rate of Kindergarteners (remember missing a single dose of a shot for school categorizes one as "unvax") warrants any interest, desire, or concern in increasing vaccination rates. While there is the continued fear campaign stating that vaccination rates are falling, historically they haven't been much higher than this. I think this illustrates the difference between taking a historical 20 year plus picture of vaccination rates compared to a 5 year picture.

As far as antibiotics, I haven't noticed people or the media being that concerned about it. Especially the 80% of US antibiotic use in animal feed lots - that part of the conversation seems to be strangely absent from most conversations. I recall a recent Frontline program that showed that the miles surrounding large farming operations had the highest amount of antibiotic resistant infections despite experts continuing to say that these types of bacteria could never leave the farm and get into the soil or water miles away.

In the US in 2009 confined animal feed lots used 29 million pounds of antibiotics. Antibiotic resistance is certainly a world problem with irresponsible use everywhere. I know people who take antibiotics like candy here in the US as well. Some Drs may have strayed from prescribing it as often, but it doesn't seem to be the norm as of yet. I'm not sure how much India uses, it would be interesting to compare the rates, though.
 

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According the the CDC "Each year in the United States, at least 2 million people become infected with bacteria that are resistant to antibiotics and at least 23,000 people die each year as a direct result of these infections."

And yet, 130 some cases of Measles (only 18 of those in unvaccinated children according to the CDC), means we need to rid parents the right to consent to Hep B for school.

Hmmm sounds pretty logical.
 
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