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points to think of for a transfer to hospital birth plan

656 Views 14 Replies 10 Participants Last post by  SusannahM
I am not planning a hospital birth, but, who knows, being transfered might end up in one anyway. Just the thought is enough to make me want to run as fast as possible, but well.....

To clarify, I've already had a very traumatic (albeit vaginal) hospital birth, so that might cloud my judgement here
and explain maybe the one or other weird point on my list ( or what I've thought of so far)

But, what are those points that might be especially impotant and need to be adressed in a birth plan which will only be used if I get a transfer? Obviously, I should have a c-section plan...are there any out there on-line? I don't even know what every step in that procedure is, but, for example, I'd NEVER, never ever want to have one lying there spread eagle, I think that might be enough to send me into another round of PTSD ( which I am sure I had after my 1st birth)

Should I get a female back-up OB? But then what's the point if nowadays everybody works in joint practises and you get whoever is on call. I will NOT deliver with a male doctor ! CAN-NOT.Or any male around.

This is driving me crazy, so back, to the original question, what should I have in that plan?
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Do you have a midwife or are you going unassisted? If you have a midwife with hospital privileges then have a very clear discussion with her about what is acceptable to you in the case of a hospital transfer. It is HER job to be your advocate in that situation. If she does not have hospital privileges then she could still accompany you to the hospital as a "doula" and speak for you there. Consider signing something giving her the right to make medical decisions for you if you are comfortable with that. The last thing you need in the case of a transfer is to be having to advocate for yourself because chances are you will be incapable of doing so in an emergency situation.

Also, please keep in mind that if you are having to transfer it will probably be because there is a dangerous situation brewing and the important thing will be to just get your baby out safely. I can understand how you feel about men in the delivery room because I felt the same way at my first (very traumatic) hospital birth. In the end it wasn't the male OB who showed up for 5 minutes to delivery the baby who made it terrible, it was the disgusting behaviour of the female nurses.... sorry, I digress.

You will do great and chances are your homebirth will go off without a hitch.
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I've foudn that aroudn here at least, OB practices are starting to recognize the importance of women doctors and there are several locally that have only women. My backup practice has three or four female CNMs, four framle OB'sm and one male perinatologist (I think..he does some of the higher-risk stuff; I've never met him). My old OB practice (that refuses to see me bc of homebirth, but that's another story) actually split the practice so that there would be an all-female practice. I suspect you'll be able to find one that is all female.

I've wondered about the same thing as you though; esp. since it's not only doctors but also nurses and techs and who knows who else. For us homebirthers there could be ER staff involved. I'm thinking of finding some way to not e a history of trauma/abuse/psychological issues that require a bit of extra care. I'm not sure how to phrase it. I don't want to share abuse issues with random hospital people, especially since a lot of my problem with male staff is not an abuse issue but a hospital trauma issue.

I've heard that hospitals will generally be more cautious if you let them know you have issues, but I'm just not sure.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by tie-dyed
I've wondered about the same thing as you though; esp. since it's not only doctors but also nurses and techs and who knows who else. For us homebirthers there could be ER staff involved. I'm thinking of finding some way to not e a history of trauma/abuse/psychological issues that require a bit of extra care. I'm not sure how to phrase it. I don't want to share abuse issues with random hospital people, especially since a lot of my problem with male staff is not an abuse issue but a hospital trauma issue.

I've heard that hospitals will generally be more cautious if you let them know you have issues, but I'm just not sure.
Right. I'll definately ask my doula ( when I hired one next month after moving
) about this and the midwives at the free standing birth center,too, if there is a wat to incorporate that into a birth plan or what and how.

So, any other points I am not thinking about? What about monitoring? Wouldn't they insist about this after a transfer? Shoul I copy the research showing how unreliable it is? What about internals? I am going internal free this pregnancy unless I'm overcome with desire to know at the end, inclduing my labour.

Should I tour the back up hospital and ask for a copy of their policies? Can I already take the standard consent forms they hand out when you normally go to the hospital and adjust them at home? ( hey, if I can black out passages at the dentists I can there,too
)

I know it all seems very combative from me but I can not feel different about hospital care providers, hey, my mom's a nurse with L&D experience and I'd meet her with the same attitude, I don't trust them with anything further than to the end of my nose.

I was also considering making a map with copies of all the research I've done and comments from me as to why I make this or that decision so when I'm in labour my doula can just point to my folder or I can just hand it over without having to discuss.
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Umm, let's see. No separation from baby unless NECESSARY and dh or my mom goes along with baby. No eye goop, vitamin K or vaccines at all (include a copy of your vax exemption if you don't vax). No episiotomy at all for any reason.

In case of c/s, I would ask for minimal drugs (because I react badly to narcotics and other drugs) and double row of sutures... and if my abs have separated too much, would they mind sewing them back together while they're in there.


But like you, the idea of a hospital is terrifying (BTDT) and would have to be necessary to save the life of my baby or myself.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by busybusymomma

In case of c/s, I would ask for minimal drugs (because I react badly to narcotics and other drugs) and double row of sutures....
ha, I never would have thought about that....care to elaborate?
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With our two homebirths we had transport plans -- ie where to go, for instance the closest hospital only has a stage 1 nursery and my WM brings that with her so we knew if we were to transport for the baby we would to to a different hospital that had a stage 2. My MW shared that if we went to a stage one they would take the baby by ambulance to stage 2 and we wouldn't be able to go in the ambulance.

DH and I had discussed that if we transported for me after the baby had been born he would never let them see the baby. Assure them that the baby had already been checked and was perfect. MW sited cases where they wanted to 'check' the baby and did not return for HOURS


Even though my MW is not on staff she would transport with me and stay with me even if we had to tell them she was my doula so that they wouldn't give us grief. She has been doing this for many years so many hospitals & doctors know and respect her but if we got someone that didn't know her and seemed somewhat hostile we would say she was my doula or mother


We had to know where the closest fire house, ambulance, etc was so that we knew how long it would take. We had drawn up maps and directions to the two different hospitals we would go to - you don't want to have to look up directions when it's an emergency.

I am sure you won't need it but a transport plan is important to have.

Keri
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This is mine which is only a draft atm. HTH


Quote:
In case of transfer - vaginal birth
•We have a bag packed with my Medicare card, toiletries and baby clothes in my bedroom.
•DP will travel with me in the car or ambulance. Bring the baby capsule. Our other children will go to their support people's homes.
•Our full address, with the nearest crossroad, is typed out beside the phone to tell the ambulance if necessary. Remember the phone needs to be plugged back in.
•No medications will be administered without my prior consent, or in the event of my incapacity, DP's. This excludes none and specifically includes oxytocics, analgesics, barbiturates and tranquillisers.
•I am not to be offered pain relief. I am aware of my options and will ask for relief as needed.
•The amniotic sac will not be artificially ruptured without specific consent and private discussion between the parents.
•No intravenous fluids will be given without prior permission or good medical reason as determined by the parents and the physician in consultation.
•No vaginal examinations will be performed without prior permission and good medical reason as determined by the parents and the physician in consultation.
•There will be no routine foetal monitoring, either internal or external. Frequent listening to the foetal heart is expected. A Doppler may be used if desired. If there is medical indication for continuous monitoring, eg CTG, I may consent to a brief period of monitoring provided I am able to choose a position. The monitor is to be removed after a reasonable trace is obtained (absolutely not more than 30 minutes without exception).
•The father and support person will stay throughout labour and birth.
•The mother will walk during labour and will be assisted by staff in assuming whatever position is most comfortable during labour and birth. I will not be arbitrarily confined to bed during labour. If the birth is happening away from the bed, say in the shower, I do not wish to be moved from this position.
* Do not speak to me during contractions or when I appear to be concentrating on my labour. Questions may be addressed to my DP if urgent and only away from my hearing.
•There will be no episiotomy
* In the unlikely event, I prefer ventouse to forceps but these will only be employed after full discussion with the parents and consent from the mother and no episiotomy. I want to push my baby out while the ventouse applies constant pressure but is not used to pull the baby out.
•The parents will be the first to touch the baby's head. The father may catch the baby.
•There will be no students, hospital house staff, or other non-essential personnel in the room during labour and birth. Anyone who wishes to speak to us must introduce themselves in full and explain their purpose for being present.
•The room will be warm and the lights dimmed. Excessive noise will be avoided and people present at the moment of birth will speak very softly so as to avoid startling the baby.
•The baby will be placed straight on the mother's abdomen and gently massaged and caressed after being born. A blanket will cover the baby and mother. The baby may be breastfed within minutes of birth and will not be wiped or cleaned in any way.
•The cord will not be clamped or cut until it has stopped pulsating however long that takes.
•The 3rd stage of labour is not to be managed but is to proceed at its own pace. The use of oxytocic drugs and manual removal of the placenta is to be reserved for true medical emergencies.
•The baby is not to be given vitamin K or Hepatitis B injections.
• The baby is not to be taken to the nursery unaccompanied. Either the mother or father must always be present.
•Apgar and well baby checks will only be done by observation while the baby is on the mother. Weighing and measuring are only to be done if the parents request it and much later after the birth.

Transfer plan - caesarean
•Epidural anaesthesia will be used. There will be no pre-operative medications, especially sedative drugs, and no sedatives after birth either. A general anaesthetic is a last resort and the parents must consent in full prior to administration.
•The father and support person will remain with the mother at all times
•The mother will hold the baby while the incision is being closed and has the assistance of the father if required. One arm must be left free.
*A double layer closure is required.
•A lotus birth is required. We can explain this to any staff who are curious but it is not optional for us. We will supply the bag to contain the placenta with us once out of theatre. In theatre an appropriately sized dish is fine.
•The baby will be placed straight on the mother's skin, unwashed. A blanket can go over both of them. Apgar and well baby checks will only be done by observation while the baby is on the mother.
•No one will announce the baby's sex.
•There will be no unnecessary speaking, this is a birth for us, not an everyday working event.
•There will be no period in the nursery. Rooming in will be immediate and continuous. Parents and baby will be in the recovery room after delivery.
•There will be no separation of mother and baby unless one or other is genuinely seriously ill or unconscious.
•If the mother is ill the baby will be carried in kangaroo care style by the father only. There will be no use of plastic boxes with wheels.
•The baby will receive Vitamin K but not Hepatitis B injections.

In the event our baby is unwell:
•Any procedures must be explained in full and informed, written consent must be obtained before any intervention is performed.
•A parent will remain with the baby at all times - no exceptions.
•The baby will only be fed breast milk. Absolutely no formula feeding or dummy without our written consent. We will use a donor for EBM if none is available and our baby requires more than colostrum until my milk comes in.
•Even if our baby is premature, there will be no period in the nursery. Rooming in will be immediate and continuous unless there is a genuine problem with the baby and informed, written consent is obtained from the parents for treatment of the baby.
•Kangaroo care and as much skin to skin contact with parents as possible while our baby is unwell.
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Janet, that sounds excellent and was very helpful.

I am wondering, can I take this plan and make anyone who is caring for me read it and sign that they read it ?

I feel this is important to have something in hand that my consent is required for about everything.
I've been thinking of this same topic for my upcoming homebirth, and trying not to dwell on it (happy thoughts, not scary thoughts!
). Glad to know I'm not the only one with the thought of hospital transfer nagging in my head! The hospital I would have to go to (for insurance purposes) has a website that makes the maternity area sound like a Hilton, and yet people only tell me vague stories about how it's really the unideal place in town to go. This is my biggest concern -- getting a sense of what kind of hospital it really is, so I know what I'll be dealing with in the unlikely event of a transfer. Is their website just a marketing ploy? Are their lovely "mother/baby" rooms just a facade? Will they really listen to my concerns like they promise?

I have only a couple of points to add to the thread that have come up in my research (I'm no expert or anything, this is just what I've found). First, regarding getting people to sign a birth plan, everything I read makes a point that birth plans are not legally binding in any way, and that it depends on the hospital and its staff as to whether the plan is taken seriously or laughed at, or even read at all. I would think, especially if the situation is a big emergency where time is of the essence, it would be even harder to get them to deal with a birth plan (and in this instance, perhaps understandably so -- they want to use their time saving you and/or the baby rather than reading a piece of paper). There is a new idea someone on some other thread posted about -- modifying your hospital consent form. Apparently, if you do it right, you can make it so the hospital must ask you (or partner if you're unable) for permission to do any procedure. They won't like this, but it's your legal right, and it might be more efficient than trying to push a birth plan during an emergency. The website to check out is
www.ican-online.org.
You have to look under "Resources" then "White Papers". Then look for "Enforcing and Promoting the Rights of Women Seeking Vaginal Birth After Cesarean (VBAC): A Primer." You have to scroll through and look for the part about "Customizing Your Consent Forms: The New Birth Plan." It's totally buried in there. That's the only place I know to find info about this idea.

Anyway, my other thought was the EFM monitor. I want nothing to do with that thing, personally, and I don't see why they can't use a doppler or a fetoscope, but I read another article that makes me wonder if it's worth submitting to in an emergency. Here's the article.
This is a great article, but don't read it if you're trying to avoid negative stories! Anyway, what struck me here is the part about a mother whose baby was in distress, and when the midwifes tried to transfer, the EMT's and then the hospital treated the situation as though there had been no midwife caring for her and started from scratch on trying to diagnose the problem (and botching some things along the way), thereby prolonging the time the baby was having trouble getting oxygen. This happened in a state where midwifery was illegal, so hopefully that's why they were all so ignorant, but we never know. Anyway, when the woman got to the hospital, the midwife couldn't stay (for fear of being arrested), and the woman refused the fetal monitor. In this case, though, had she let them put it on, they would have seen the problem very quickly through their own favorite method and realized she needed a C-section fast. As it was, hospital procedure dragged on and on, and the baby was stillborn.

I still don't know how where I stand on how to handle a hospital transfer (I'm going to talk to my midwife about it soon), but I think there is a certain value in letting them do their thing, horrid as it may be, if it's a true emergency. Plus, the more hospital-oriented midwife I took a hypnobirthing class from made a point that they're more likely to cooperate with you if you don't approach them with a fighting attitude (in your birth plan or in person). If you think about it from their point of view (which believe me, I don't like doing), it's scary to deal with a patient who doesn't want to take your experience and advice seriously. Perhaps this is the importance of the midwife-turned-doula in a hospital transfer -- mediating between mother and hospital so that they don't alienate each other.

I don't want to sound like I'm down on birth plans -- I'm certainly going to have one -- but these are some thoughts I've had about how they'd work in the event of hospital transfer.
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I didn't make a transfer plan. I told my MW and dh what I wanted and trusted them to be my advocates.
Quote:

Originally Posted by phoebemommy

I still don't know how where I stand on how to handle a hospital transfer (I'm going to talk to my midwife about it soon), but I think there is a certain value in letting them do their thing, horrid as it may be, if it's a true emergency.
I suppose in a lifethreatening true emergency I'd care less because, as said, it's about my and the baby's life. But transfers happen for non emergency reasons also, like a prolonged labour for example. In that case, I want to be prepared


Thanks for the links, they were very helpful.
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I agree re: CTG. I won't personally choose to have it, this is a plan I'm putting on my website soon and it's in draft form
We are currently investigating in Australia some ways to make birth plans legally binding in the same way that a "living will" is legally binding. I don't know what you call them in the US but it's a plan you make in case of trauma or accident where you inform the hospital of your requests about life support etc. They have to follow it.

And just let me add, I'm a survivor of a horrific hb TF last time so I have no illusions about staff giving a toss about me or MY plan. My plan is really for my support people to be really clear about what's going to happen if I'm unconscious or unable to speak.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by huggerwocky
I suppose in a lifethreatening true emergency I'd care less because, as said, it's about my and the baby's life. But transfers happen for non emergency reasons also, like a prolonged labour for example. In that case, I want to be prepared


Thanks for the links, they were very helpful.
I guess I'm in agreement with a few others here, in the case of a transfer, I knew it would truly be a situation where I needed the help, and I wasn't going to go in with a fighting attitude. My husband and midwife were very clear on my wishes, so I trusted them to be my advocates.

As far as being afraid to go in for a prolonged birth, IMO that's something you should discuss more with your midwife. My midwife's practice only had a 2% transfer rate, and probably at least half those were women who requested it on their own after a prolonged labor. They probably didn't need it, but were tired. So, discuss with your midwife options that would really help YOU carry on if you're tired and just thinking you want it over with. What would get you going again? Make sure the midwife knows these things. In some cases, their stories involved a husband who wasn't being supportive enough. Maybe discuss with your midwife giving your husband a swift kick in the but* if he's not giving the support he needs (figuratively, of course
).

I never, ever worried about transferring because I felt like giving up. That's just not me, and I knew it. So, I figured the transfer rate I really had to worry about was 1%, and if I was that 1%, then it was probably something potentially going quite wrong, and I needed the doctors to do their thing with strong guidance from my husband.

(Birth went great, btw, no transfer needed.)
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