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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Yes it's true. One of the moms that I have playgroup with actually did this. Actually, her dd is 23 months old, not yet 2. I know some of us complain sometimes about mainstream methods, but this is outrageous, right?

She said she did this because dd was being "bad".


I've been trying to be tolerant of the different ways the other moms in the playgroup handle their kids, but I'm not sure how long I can do this. I feel like I'm participating in the wrongness of it all by sitting there and watching it happen without intervening. Not only this, but with stuff like spanking and general disrespect towards her dd. The unspoken rules of the group is that moms will not tell other moms how to raise their kids. In fact, I once confronted this particular mom because she was yelling at my ds. I told her that she should leave the disciplining up to me. Other moms in the group also certainly do not "get" my extended nursing and "lax" disciplining (whereas some definitely do). So although no one is rude to me, I'm starting to feel that my time would be better spent doing one on one stuff with ds or doing stuff with people I do enjoy. But I've built a relationship with these moms and feel that I should teach ds to hold on to friends and to embrace people even if they do not agree with you or do things your way.

What would you do? We need to teach our kids about diversity, right? I feel like I shouldn't run away every time I see a mom do things that I don't agree with.
 

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I say run too… I don't think the diversity thing is necessarily true in situations like this either. Isn't diversity supposed to be a positive, enriching thing in one's life? Putting up with others who disrespect their children isn't a good example of positive diversity, in my mind anyway. If that is diversity than I'd rather not have it.

I don't need to agree with people that I like on everything and I can tolerate even embrace many differences, but…. The way a person treats a child is a deal breaker for me. I have no tolerance for people who mistreat their children. And yes, what I consider mistreatment others may not, but those are my feelings and I can not ignore them for the sake of understanding and getting along, You know?
 

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Wouldn't this be considered neglect in a child so young? A two year old missing a meal when he/she is hungry is more than punishment it's down right abuse. I don't think any child should have food withheld and especially not as a punishment, but a two year old? I would have a hard time not saying something.

As far as not going to the group that is something you will have to decide for yourself I don't think any of us can tell you what is right for you or DS.
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by hunnybumm
I don't think any child should have food withheld and especially not as a punishment, but a two year old? I would have a hard time not saying something.

I'm right there with you. Food is a requirement for life, and our children are dependent upon us to provide them with sustenance. Manipulating them by exploiting their dependence is such a ridiculous thing to do.

What you'll decide about your group is tricky to me, and I'll tell you why. If you remove yourself from the group you remove your influence, however small, in these children's lives. Over time, children can be deeply impacted by observing adults who do things differently.

My own sister does so many things with her children that I know any child psychologist would tell you are absolutely horrible. She is bull headed and won't listen to anyone. Saying something only causes her to cut off contact with her kids for a period of time, sometimes a long time. Then the children are robbed of the influence of spending time in a home where respect of ALL members is just a way of life. As much as I intensely dislike my sister, and I have to be honest, I do, I don't get involved much because it's a fruitless endeavor when I do. I just hope to show the children another way. In my own life, seeing another way was enough to start me on a completely different path that broke the cycle for my daughter and hopefully for all of my descendents.

I know this is different, because this is my SISTER, but it's just something that I throw out there for your consideration.
 

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I completely agree with the no giving food scenario being entirely inappropriate and a violation to the childs well being. However I would try to stay in the group, I know it may be hard sitting there and not interveening but just you being there and showing them that there is a better way to handle things is important. They may not "get it" the first time or the 50th time, but eventually if you stick it through and stay consistant and let them know you are willing to help them change, one or two may come around. Maybe instead of phrasing things like, "I do the disciplining" Oops just realized she was talking to YOUR child sorry, but maybe when you see something starting suggest, "I had a similar problem with ____ I found the best way to handle was to _______." That might let them know you can relate to them and your able to bring up an alternative discipline. HTH.
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by abac
Sarihah, everything you said. Your sister sounds very much like mine.

I feel for you abac. It's one of the most painful aspects of my life, and totally out of my control.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I can write pages about the no food as punishment thing. It is one of the worst forms of control for the very fact that it is a necessity and can lead to eating disorders, etc. When dh heard about it, he was like, should we call social services? My response was that sadly enough, it is probably a more normal type of punishment than we would think, though 2 years old! Come on.

I can understand the people who say run because if it wasn't for ds, I probably would just blow her off and say it's not worth it. But I really feel duty-bound to not give up on people, again, even if they seem to be horrid. I mean ds will have horrible kids in his classroom, right? And horrible teachers. He'll have to make do.

For those of you who say that I should stick it out, is there a reason for me to do so beyond my usefulness to the other mothers? I really need a reason for myself.

Vermillion - But is it true diversity if I approve of whatever I'm getting? I feel that diversity is not necessarily positive as is reflected in the world at large. I know ds is young, and I would never let him alone with this mom, but I think he's not too young to know that other moms do things differently. But I agree that the way a mom treats her kids is very important in determining compatibility. I suppose that is why I'm so torn.

Sarihah - Sorry to hear about your sis. I actually have a great relationship with my sister and our kids love each other. But I have heard of sisters who can't get along, and it makes for a very unhappy situation. I can understand why you want to try to stay in her life for her kids, but what do you get out of it? Is it worthwhile for you too?

Starr - She feels the same way of me as I of her. I am as likely to take her advice as she of me. So maybe I wouldn't influence her at all except maybe to force her more the other way because she does think I'm neglectful (because I don't tell ds what to do all the time) and she probably thinks I continue to nurse ds for my own kicks.
 

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I also think that staying around and sticking through it you are teaching your child a valuable lesson. That hey not everyone is like us. You are exposing them to an entire differently group of women and contrasting ideas. You are showing your child how some not so nice mommies may parent and how you yourself are helping them to change. You are also teaching them not to run away from something that isn't familiar to them. I don't think your child will be scarred in any way emotionally but it gives he/she a chance to play and socialize with other children who they may not have so much in common with. This will help them make friends easier in the future. You are also teaching them that its ok to hang out with other people not necesarily like you. Especially if your child has already made friends with some of the other children it would be difficult to not let them play together because of the differences. Does all this ranting make sense? Didn't realize I got carried away. :LOL
 

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I think my daughter appreciates me more because of the contrast between our way of life and the ways of people around us. Without question, she realizes that there are a lot of mothers who do things very differently than I do, and she articulates her satisfaction with our home and our lives in ways that are extremely precious and gratifying to me.
 

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I wouldn't stick it out. I know I'm in the minority here. I would tell your friends in the group that you are leaving because you couldn't handle the "bed without dinner" for a two year old story and I would find a new group.

I wouldn't say that about just anything, but this pushes my buttons all over the place. I also don't see the value in exposing a two year old to people who punish this way. I expose my two year old to people from different racial, religious, ethnic and class backgrounds, people who speak different languages, people who watch TV or eat meat (we don't), people who say ridiculous though well-intentioned sexist things to him. But I don't see any value in exposing him to parents who yell at children who aren't even in their family, and who treat their own children even worse. Not the right kind of diversity!
 

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I agree with Captain Optimism.

Quote:
Vermillion - But is it true diversity if I approve of whatever I'm getting? I feel that diversity is not necessarily positive as is reflected in the world at large. I know ds is young, and I would never let him alone with this mom, but I think he's not too young to know that other moms do things differently. But I agree that the way a mom treats her kids is very important in determining compatibility. I suppose that is why I'm so torn.
Regarding diversity I definitely don't feel that you have to always only approve of what you're getting, there is just a line of what is acceptable and what is not for the sake of diversity. JMO.

Like, I am not really thrilled when I see other moms giving their children soda and chips every day for a snack. It isn't something I would do, but it isn't something that would make me like that person any less. I could deal with that.

Hitting (spanking), withholding food, shaming, etc. Things like that I DO consider to be abuse. Some may disagree but that's ok. So, yes, technically by exposing your kids to this it is diversity, something different than yourself/family, but is it worth a lesson in diversity to be exposed to violence and/or abuse? I don't think so, but that's just me.

I don't think my child needs to be exposed to that sort of thing to learn any kind of lesson. I would rather treat him well and have him exposed to others who treat kids well and I'll take my chances that he will learn better that way. He can see crap like that when he gets older, it will be inevitable at some point, but for now while he is little I see nothing valuable about exposing him to violence and abuse towards children.

JMO!
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by captain optimism
I wouldn't stick it out. I know I'm in the minority here. I would tell your friends in the group that you are leaving because you couldn't handle the "bed without dinner" for a two year old story and I would find a new group.

I wouldn't say that about just anything, but this pushes my buttons all over the place. I also don't see the value in exposing a two year old to people who punish this way. I expose my two year old to people from different racial, religious, ethnic and class backgrounds, people who speak different languages, people who watch TV or eat meat (we don't), people who say ridiculous though well-intentioned sexist things to him. But I don't see any value in exposing him to parents who yell at children who aren't even in their family, and who treat their own children even worse. Not the right kind of diversity!

ITA
 

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Did the OP's son witness this two year old being sent to bed without any dinner? I got the impression that the OP was told that this had happened, without being present at the time that it occurred.

If you decide to eschew contact with people who parent in ways that you are strongly opposed to, whether or not you are present when these parents do things that you know are wrong, what's left for you?

I don't know about you, and I hope I don't come off in an ugly way, but there aren't too many people in my world who parent the way that I think parenting should be done. I also know a lot of people in marriages and relationships that I don't think are very healthy for either the adults or the children. Maybe I live in a very dysfunctional corner of the world.
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But these people have other aspects to their beings, they aren't ONLY these negative characteristics and traits.
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarihah
Did the OP's son witness this two year old being sent to bed without any dinner? I got the impression that the OP was told that this had happened, without being present at the time that it occurred.

Perhaps her child didn't witness this one particular event, but he is likely to witness other negative things from people who have no problems treating kids with such disrespect, such as-

From OP-

Quote:
In fact, I once confronted this particular mom because she was yelling at my ds.
Sariah-

Quote:
If you decide to eschew contact with people who parent in ways that you are strongly opposed to, whether or not you are present when these parents do things that you know are wrong, what's left for you?
Way less stress and lower blood pressure for starters!

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But these people have other aspects to their beings, they aren't ONLY these negative characteristics and traits.
Maybe so, but sometimes the negatives far outweigh any positives. Abuse and mistreatment towards children is definately a perfect example of "not worth the good stuff" in my book.
 

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I say stay, too. I know that you have an unspoken policy of not telling each other how to raise your kids, but is a gasp and shocked expression out of the question? Maybe an eye roll? Maybe a "Oh, poor dear child!"? You may be able to subtly influence this mother and how she parents. If by nothing other than setting a good example.
 

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i have found myself in a similar situation. at first the differences were tolerable. but as the kids have gotten older it has gotten to the point where i don't feel any support or encouragement from the group. so i'm not getting what i need from it and my daughter doesn't like playing with some of the kids because they are too aggressive. so i have been working my way out of the group gradually and just getting together with a couple of the other moms in the group for one on one playdates. these particular moms are also working their way out of the group for the same reason. we find hanging out with each other supportive and encouraging and our kids play pretty well together. i don't want to leave the group abruptly because we have been in the group for two years now and i don't want there to be hurt feelings. it is also a small town and i'm bound to run into them everywhere. so i've just been busy and not able to go all the time and pretty soon i plan to let them know that we are just too busy now that my dd has other activities and can't commit to a weekly playgroup anymore. i think if you find a relationship is unhealthy, it is best to end it. i'd like to be able to maintain the relationship enough so that we can chat when we see other out and about and are at the same birthday parties, etc. but i don't want to maintain the relationship to the point of getting together weekly. i actually like all of the women in the group, some more than others. but i don't dislike anyone in it. but as far as being a part of a regular on going group with them. it just isn't working. the few of us in the group that do get on well together are supporting each other in our efforts to parent, while it feels like the rest of the group is discouraging it.
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarihah
If you decide to eschew contact with people who parent in ways that you are strongly opposed to, whether or not you are present when these parents do things that you know are wrong, what's left for you?

I don't know about you, and I hope I don't come off in an ugly way, but there aren't too many people in my world who parent the way that I think parenting should be done. I also know a lot of people in marriages and relationships that I don't think are very healthy for either the adults or the children. Maybe I live in a very dysfunctional corner of the world.
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But these people have other aspects to their beings, they aren't ONLY these negative characteristics and traits.
Well, your milage may vary, as is the common expression---there are just some things that push my buttons, that exceed my tolerance. I could even handle a mom saying, "I potched him when he ran into the street" better than "she was being 'bad' so I sent her to bed without dinner."
 
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