[Kim]

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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">I have to say I'm a little uncomfortable with your continued push to dig up negatives about homeschooling especially on a pro-homeschooling forum.</td>
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">I too wonder why you want the "bad" reasons.</td>
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I think her questions are fair. No, we don't know where snyderjoint stands on homeschooling, but you know what? Personally, many of us don't.<br><br>
If you don't think that there are negatives to a homeschool/unschooling environment than you don't need to respond. I'm hopeful that if you have chosen to hs that you are confident in your decision despite what someone else would deem a "downside".<br><br>
Frankly, when I researched vax-ing my children it was great to get the pros and cons. A discussion about the negative aspects of homeschooling is completely valid. Last I checked, MDC is pro-homeschooling, but is *also* pro-public schools. (There is a Learning at School forum too.)

 

[Kim]

Oops, I posted in the wrong thread.<br><br>
Still, I think this discussion is valid. FTR, I am strongly pro-homeschooling and hoping to do so with my own children. But I would never make a decision with out learning as much about it as possible (pros and cons).

 

[oldcrunchymom]

Well, here is why I am hesitant to answer the question. Snyderjoint has not yet explained to us the purpose of her paper. If the purpose is to portray homeschooling in a negative light, digging up every little thing that might be considered "bad," then I am not going to help her (him?) out by giving her a quote.<br><br>
Also, as others have noted, the various reasons for homeschooling are so subjective. The only real reason I could think of NOT to homeschool is if you didn't want to do it. The negativity in that case might very well negate the good stuff that normally comes from homeschooling.

 

[Kim]

Does it really matter how the information is going to be used? If someone is looking for negative information about hs, there are plenty of places to look. Perhaps the questions could have been brought up more sensitively the first time, but an apology was made and the question posed differently.<br><br>
Personally, I'm interested in learning about the negative aspects from ppl who are dedicated to hs rather than those that think it is abusive or completely "fringe".<br><br>
I'm surprised that the question can't even come up without everyone thinking this person is troll or something.

 

[nicole lisa]

Kim, I didn't participate in either of snyderjoint's threads because he/she hasn't even introduced her/himself. I ahve no idea who this person is and on a message board when you post for the first time you usually share a bit about yourself, how you came to find the site etc. If it's just info on homeschooling he/she is looking for and not interested in being an active member of MDC than I think there's a ton of books out there both pro and anti homeschooling that would give most of the same answers we would.<br><br>
Just, to me, doesn't feel right to be tapped for info for a paper for school without any sharing of who he or she is and what his/her educational philosophy is.

 

[Wilhemina]

I was uncomfortable with the question, "What are bad reasons to homeschool," because I don't want to put myself in the position of judging some other families' decisions. I certainly don't want others (especially the government) to judge the whys and wherefores of my decision.<br><br>
As was mentioned on the thread, "homeschooling" in order to hide abuse and neglect would definately be a bad reason. I would argue (as someone did on that thread) that those families are not homeschooling, but simply using the label for their convenience.<br><br>
Now if the question is, "What are some reasons not to homeschool?" That is a whole 'nother ball of wax. I would be glad to consider and respond to that kind of an inquiry.

 

[GranolaMoon]

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>nicole lisa</strong></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Kim, I didn't participate in either of snyderjoint's threads because he/she hasn't even introduced her/himself. I ahve no idea who this person is and on a message board when you post for the first time you usually share a bit about yourself, how you came to find the site etc. If it's just info on homeschooling he/she is looking for and not interested in being an active member of MDC than I think there's a ton of books out there both pro and anti homeschooling that would give most of the same answers we would.<br><br>
Just, to me, doesn't feel right to be tapped for info for a paper for school without any sharing of who he or she is and what his/her educational philosophy is.</div>
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This is me. I'm not doing someone else's homework for them.

 

[Kim]

Thank you for your thoughts so far.<br><br>
I can appreciate that many of you are not willing to discuss your personal philosophies with someone that you don't trust. However, I'm a little surprised that the thread was closed because it is "possible" that snyderjoint is here for the wrong reason. Frankly he/she hasn't posted enough here to know either way. So much for innocent until proven guilty...<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">I think there's a ton of books out there both pro and anti homeschooling that would give most of the same answers we would.</td>
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Can you give me any specifics titles? My dh is about 1/2 on board for homeschooling. If I can come up with a lot of good and excellent rebuttals for the "bad", I may win my argument! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/thumb.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="thumbs up"><br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">Now if the question is, "What are some reasons not to homeschool?" That is a whole 'nother ball of wax. I would be glad to consider and respond to that kind of an inquiry.</td>
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Give me all the low-down, dirty secrets of homeschooling. (For the same reason as above -- if I have all the disadvantages in mind for rebuttals, my argument is that much stronger.)<br><br>
Thanks!

 

[nicole lisa]

Kim,<br><br>
I started with and return to every once and a while John Taylor Gatto's <span style="text-decoration:underline;">Dumbing us Down.</span> I always reccommend him because he's a teacher (NY State teacher of the year one year) and he gets into the history behind public education. I find people not sure about homeschooling respond to the book because an awarded teacher wrote it.<br><br>
Anything by John Holt. I have <span style="text-decoration:underline;">How Children Fail</span>, <span style="text-decoration:underline;">How Children Learn</span>, and <span style="text-decoration:underline;">Freedom and Beyond</span> .<br><br>
Mary Griffiths and David Albert are also great.<br><br>
When asked why we do it DP always turns the question around to people and asks them what their public school experience was like and we've yet to hear someone not go "gotchya" or something like that. Most people understand when you ask them to talk about their school experiences.<br><br>
I think the reason why I wasn't willing to trust snyderjoint without any intro or give and take (that's how conversations go, eh? Not just asking questions) is because here we don't have to justify home/unschooling. The Learning at Home and Beyond forum is one of the few places we don't have to convince people we know what we're doing or reassure them our kids are fine or butt heads against stereotypes. Does that make sense?

 

[Kim]

Thanks for the recommendations, Nicole Lisa! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/thumb.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="thumbs up"><br><br>
I've been meaning to look up the book by Gatto. I have 'How Children Learn' by Holt as well as 'You Are Your Child's First Teacher'. However, neither dispute hs as anything but a positive experience. We know all too well the downside of atteding Public School. What are the negative statistics associated with hs? There must be some data recorded somewhere?<br><br>
As for snyderjoint:<br><br>
I guess I am just willing to give someone the benefit of the doubt. The way the questions were approached didn't set off any alarms for <a href="http:/she">me...he/she</a> just came off as curious. Perhaps he/she is giving a presentation in class and he/she wanted to be able to discuss hs pros and cons by using real-life examples rather than info provided from this/that reference?

 

[snyderjoint]

I wasn't trying to offend anyone, or make anybody put there guard up. I thought I did give an intro, but If I didn't I will again. My name is Amy and I'm 21. I'm an Education major in college, I'm just getting started in taking courses that apply to my major instead of general ed classes. I'm probably going to have to do alot of papers of education. But for this class I was assigned homeschooling, which I think is pretty interesting. I really don't mean to offend anyone as you'll probably see me hanging around this forums for the next few months or so. I'm merely trying to get alot of info on hsing, from people who actually do it. That's all, I'm not trying to hurt any one ore there families, just trying to get people's opinions. I hope that's ok?

 

[annettemarie]

Amy, it is more than OK, but when you phrase a question in a negative way, it gets people's hackles up. You may want to either hang back and listen, and get to know us for a while, or put a little more thought into how you phrase things.

 

[em&namama]

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Kim</strong></div>
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Can you give me any specifics titles? My dh is about 1/2 on board for homeschooling. If I can come up with a lot of good and excellent rebuttals for the "bad", I may win my argument! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/thumb.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="thumbs up"><br><br><br><br>
Give me all the low-down, dirty secrets of homeschooling. (For the same reason as above -- if I have all the disadvantages in mind for rebuttals, my argument is that much stronger.)<br><br>
Thanks!</div>
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This is such a debatable topic and it seems to me like it's all subjective. I mean I don't see any cons for me but it would be ridiculous of me to say it would be a good thing for a child if a parent doesn't want to do it.<br><br>
A book I found very enlightening is an old one that I received from a friend. It's called The Successful Homeschool Family Handbook by the Moore's. It has a Christian slant to it but what it does is go into detail about how kids learn, their development mentally and emotionally, and gives answers and examples of common situations. This comes from two people who for years were involved in public schooling and now have years of experience in another direction. I cannot personally vouch for the authors but I can say that the things they talk about make total sense to me.<br><br>
I think perhaps if you're trying to find rebuttals for the "bads" or negative things for your husband the easiest way is to find out what those are and ask about them specifically.<br><br>
On another forum I belong to a woman was in a similar situation. She was upset because she had researched it to death and her husband kept bringing up all these supposed negatives. They resolved it by setting a date in the future where they would both bring copies of their reseach to look over and discuss. Of course, he didn't have any and didn't take the time to do so. Meanwhile she was armed and he really couldn't argue. I mean she was totally willing to look at his side but she was not finding anything with negatives on her side and only positive things to boot.<br><br>
This is not meant to start a debate on which is better kwim? I just think that oftentimes the naysayers feel that way but know very little.

 

[Charles Baudelaire]

The problem I sense here is that Snyderjoint <i>may</i> be simply collecting data for what we have reason, based on her diction, to suspect is a one-sided view of homeschooling.<br><br>
What concerns me greatly is that she or he is not willing, evidently, to engage anyone here in <span style="text-decoration:underline;">conversation</span>, which I've stated before that I would certainly like to have happen, and I'm sure I'm not alone. Without actual debate, we might as well all be talking to ourselves.<br><br>
Snyderjoint, it would probably be a great idea if you'd talk <i>with</i> us.

 

[Wilhemina]

So I guess I actually have to answer the question now! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/winky.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Wink"><br><br>
Here are the only few "reasons not to homeschool" I can think of:<br><br>
1. Perhaps if it becomes an issue in a child custody battle.<br><br>
2. If the primary hsing parent has a health (physical or mental) concern that makes him/her feel unable to hs.<br><br>
3. If, after considering their personal situation a hsing family finds that their particular child's special needs are best served in a school setting. I don't imagine this happens often. The key here is it is up to each family. I'm imagining maybe a exhausted and pregnant mom of an autistic 12 year old who decides to seek out a half-day school program. Or the parents of an exceptionally gifted dancer who decide (along with their child) to send their teenager to a boarding school for the performing arts.<br><br><br>
I would never want a family to feel pressured to homeschool, just as I don't want to be pressured to away-school. Sometimes as a parent it is hard enough to be *still* enough to really hear (from God, from your heart, from your child) what is best. Certainly outside pressures only make the process more difficult.

 

[TanyaMT]

A book I just recently finished that touched on "negatives" or reasons someone may not want to homeschool is "Homeschooling: Take a Deep Breath --- You Can Do This!" by Terrie Lynn Bittner. As the title would suggest, it is mainly encouragement on homeschooling but she does touch on some of the reasons it may not be a good idea as well for some families. I found the book interesting.<br><br>
I have given intros in other forums but not this one I don't think (I'm a sporadic poster so can't recall for sure). Anyway, I have a 3-year-old son (actually turning 3 this week!) and we are just starting homeschooling. From a newbie perspective, I found the above book interesting and not overly scaled down and simplistic (some intro books on homeschooling seem to be) and provides a fairly realistic view from what I can discern rather than saying every day will be wonderful and joyous with my toddler. Haha.<br><br>
Anyway, there is one book that presents some of the supposed negatives in certain situations.<br><br>
Tanya

 

[nicole lisa]

OOps, Kim. I didn't give any titles that talk about the cons of homeschooling cause I don't know of any (titles that is, thought I also don't know any cons).<br><br>
I'm sure if you do a search under education at your library you will get a few titles.<br><br>
Sorry.

 

[SagMom]

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Kim</strong></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">If you don't think that there are negatives to a homeschool/unschooling environment than you don't need to respond. I'm hopeful that if you have chosen to hs that you are confident in your decision despite what someone else would deem a "downside".<br></div>
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Except that she wasn't asking for pros and cons of homeschooling, nor was she asking what the tough parts are--she was asking if there were bad reasons for homeschooling. Questioning someone's motivation for homeschooling sets up an adversarial discussion, right there. That's how the question came across--It's akin to someone going to the breastfeeding board and asking, "Are there ever bad reasons to breastfeed?"<br><br>
Personally, I LOVE a good debate/discussion and am always happy to talk about homeschooling on these boards but when a question is phrased in such a negative way, it's bound to get a negative response.<br><br>
As "Charles" said, perhaps this discussion could get rolling if Snyderjoint participated.

 

[annettemarie]

Amy, if you're out there, perhaps you could share with us reasons that you feel would be reasons NOT to homeschool, and we can go from there.

 

[mandib50]



However, neither dispute hs as anything but a positive experience. We know all too well the downside of atteding Public School. What are the negative statistics associated with hs? There must be some data recorded somewhere?<br><br>
As for snyderjoint:<br><br>
QUOTE]<br><br>
i believe there are only positive sides to homeschooling <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile"> seriously though, as a homeschooler i looked to the positives of homeschooling. why would i choose something that has downsides to it - if that were the case my children would be in public school. probably the only reason i could think that is bad about homeschooling is doing it if you don't want to, and that was already mentioned. there are many stats, but i haven't seen anything negative. you could look through this page (haven't read all the studies myself so there may be some negative stats) http:<a href="http://www.ontariohomeschool.org/discussion.html#studies" target="_blank">http://www.ontariohomeschool.org/dis...n.html#studies</a><br><br>
deschooling our lives by matt hern is a great book but no negatives there either.<br><br>
i think the main "downside" we hear about homeschooling is the socialization thing but that has been discussed here before and i think it's pretty easy to refute that argument. what are the bad sides you are hearing? it might be easier for us to help you if you tell us what you're hearing.<br>
mandi