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I think that title's sorta pathetic, but I couldn't come up with better.<br><br>
So I've been blessed to know a group of women who also have kids with food sensitivities, and often also themselves as well, and a variety of related health or behavior issues (in moms and kids). Not always, but often mom's health and kids' health are intricately intertwined. And often it's taken a lot of detective work, taking unconventional and difficult paths to figure out what's going on, and then a lot of work to heal, years of work that have permanently changed their family life.<br><br>
Beyond the quest for tangible reasons, things that need to be identified and fixed, which has been my focus for a few years now, lately I've really started wondering if there's more to the question of why.<br><br>
I have a sense that there's more, reasons I should search for to really understand why, to learn the lessons I'm supposed to from this.<br><br>
I want to at least have a sense as to why I got sick first, why is it more obvious in me, rather than the kids? Gotta be grateful for it, and I truly am, but I'm also puzzled.<br><br>
How does this affect having more kids? I've been working on my health for a few years now and the goal to consider TTC is in sight, but along the way, I've always wondered about more kids--earlier, and the likelihood of health issues is higher? Some people have a sense that their families aren't complete and choose different timing, or the timing chooses them. How do we know what to do?<br><br>
In a physical sense, my kids' health problems are due to growing in me. This process has spurred significant mental, emotional, and spiritual growth in me; so what does it mean for the kids?<br><br>
Anyone with thoughts? I'm not sure I've been clear enough, but I'm also not sure I can clarify my thoughts any further.
 

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difficult to gather my thoughts- kids' bedtime.<br>
subbing and will reply later.
 

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just read it. will ponder and come back
 

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This is hard! You have my brain spinning, but I have no clue what to write/how to put it in words.<br><br>
One big thread that runs through this for me is to look at things from an enjoy life and heal the generations perspective. I'm working hard to do as much healing as I can, to grow the healthiest kids I can, but our intolerances haven't affected our ttc schedule. Directly. I was a kid with unaddressed food/deficiencies, and I had a fun childhood and felt pretty normal. And now I'm healing. If I can heal as an adult, then kids can heal too - things don't have to be perfect from the get go. And as I type that, it seems like the people with the least respect for what food can do to/for your health are the ones who haven't experienced significant issues.<br><br>
The other thread is how everything happens for a reason. On an email list recently, someone mentioned how the really sensitive kids are the ones that make the biggest difference as adults because they can't just sit and watch. And looking back at my life so far, everything really has set me up to be attacking this puzzle here and now. And honestly, I'm LOVING it. Not every moment for sure, but the low points just make the high ones that much higher.<br><br>
And that's what's keeping me going and keeping me calm and zen.<br><br>
I was thinking the other day, about how dh taught me to love, dd is teaching me how to be healthy, and now ds is going to teach me about happiness. And I'd say those are gifts I can pass back to them, but isn't it more about not taking them away?<br><br>
Am I on the same track as what you're thinking about?
 

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I think the message is for all of us, our whole society is that we will have more sick kids, more kids with problems (adults too but it's more noticeable with kids) unless we all change and consider carefully the effects of chemicals we use and depend on, our choices about what foods to eat, etc. These kids are showing us that things need to change. It's easier to make changes to help children, especially our children, than just a vague "it's good for the environment". As autism, ADHD, allergies increase, I believe today's parents and kids will take the world in a more sustainable direction because that is the path to healing.<br><br>
I know dd's illness has given me much greater mindfulness of what we eat and drink. It's overwhelming sometimes and I'm still struggling with it.
 

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To me, illness is a reminder of the wonders and workings of nature and of medicine, and human limitations. I guess that's my spiritual take. I also am a fairly militant (when I have time and energy) disability rights activist.<br><br>
If you ever have a chance to check out the Feminists with Disabilities blog, they sometimes link to different posts and opinions about spirituality and health. Everything from accessibility issues in houses of worship, to ethical questions about assisted suicide.
 

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All I know for sure is that I would never have gotten to the place that I am at now without DS and his allergies and health issues. To be able to heal myself from chronic pain is a tremendous gift and I work hard to continue to see it that way. I have been able to heal much more than the physical, it really has been a culmination of my life thus far, echoing what Shannon has said.<br><br>
The journey has changed everything about me and my life, for good and bad. It cost me my marriage and I will never have another child.<br><br>
Why it happened to me... well I'm not sure sure something like it is not happening to everyone around me. I'm just listening to it differently and am profoundly grateful for that gift. I think everyone learns something from illness.<br><br>
What it means for my son? I don't know, that's a tough one. That's a deeply emotional topic for me. He is going to have a difficult life, and yet, it could be much much worse. He has so much that is amazing and positive and lucky though too. I'm just doing the best I can to help him achieve his potential and his joy.<br><br>
I also have such a deep connection with him. It is completely different than what it would have been if I stayed the person I was, and he was a "normal" child. This has led to healing many hurts that I accumulated in my own childhood.<br><br>
And he will have a very unique perspective on life and health that's for sure!<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>lolar2</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/15424327"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">To me, illness is a reminder of the wonders and workings of nature and of medicine, and human limitations. I guess that's my spiritual take. I also am a fairly militant (when I have time and energy) disability rights activist.<br><br>
If you ever have a chance to check out the Feminists with Disabilities blog, they sometimes link to different posts and opinions about spirituality and health. Everything from accessibility issues in houses of worship, to ethical questions about assisted suicide.</div>
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A bit OT, but I so needed to see this post now to help me focus. I'm completely fed up with not being able to take food into stadiums, theatres, etc! Was treated abominably at the ballpark last weekend. It is just so wrong when food could literally kill my child and they are just protecting their ability to sell their junk (and thus perpetuating one of the causes of the mess our children are in now). I can certainly find meaning now in being hopping mad!<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>rainbringer</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/15423387"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I think the message is for all of us, our whole society is that we will have more sick kids, more kids with problems (adults too but it's more noticeable with kids) unless we all change and consider carefully the effects of chemicals we use and depend on, our choices about what foods to eat, etc. These kids are showing us that things need to change. It's easier to make changes to help children, especially our children, than just a vague "it's good for the environment". As autism, ADHD, allergies increase, I believe today's parents and kids will take the world in a more sustainable direction because that is the path to healing.<br><br>
I know dd's illness has given me much greater mindfulness of what we eat and drink. It's overwhelming sometimes and I'm still struggling with it.</div>
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<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/yeahthat.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="yeah that"> well said. I never would have learned this profound perspective on the connection between food, toxins and health without facing these challenges.
 

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Argh, I just got back and I don't have time to sit and thoughtfully reply, and to flesh out some more thoughts on this.<br><br>
Hopefully tonight. Thanks everyone, I appreciate all the responses. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/love.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="love">
 

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Piecemeal as I can squeeze in time...<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>JacquelineR</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/15421876"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">difficult to gather my thoughts- kids' bedtime.<br>
subbing and will reply later.</div>
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<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Mammo2Sammo</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/15423065"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">just read it. will ponder and come back</div>
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Glad to have you both, add more when you've got a spare moment. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/ROTFLMAO.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="rotflmao"><br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>whoMe</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/15423132"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">This is hard! You have my brain spinning, but I have no clue what to write/how to put it in words.<br><br>
One big thread that runs through this for me is to look at things from an enjoy life and heal the generations perspective. I'm working hard to do as much healing as I can, to grow the healthiest kids I can, but our intolerances haven't affected our ttc schedule. Directly. I was a kid with unaddressed food/deficiencies, and I had a fun childhood and felt pretty normal. And now I'm healing. If I can heal as an adult, then kids can heal too - things don't have to be perfect from the get go. And as I type that, it seems like the people with the least respect for what food can do to/for your health are the ones who haven't experienced significant issues.<br><br><span>I mostly agree (and I'm going to go back to the physical manifestations of all this because I've worked so hard there, it's where my mind goes first)... I really think my extreme shyness had a biochemical basis, and that was sort of a bummer. Still a happy childhood, had friends, but it colored a lot of things for me. But most other stuff, eh, small in the grand scheme of things.</span><br><br><b>The other thread is how everything happens for a reason.</b><br><br><span>This is exactly how I feel, and finding layer after layer after layer of meaning, it's such a process of discovery.</span><br><br>
On an email list recently, someone mentioned how the really sensitive kids are the ones that make the biggest difference as adults because they can't just sit and watch. <b>And looking back at my life so far, everything really has set me up to be attacking this puzzle here and now.</b><br><br><span>I see the same thing in myself, that so many different things have contributed to my being able to deal with this, relatively successfully, at this point in my life. And in a way... these past 4.5 years now, I've matured and grown into who I am much quicker than at any other point in my adult life. I feel comfortable in my skin, with who *I* am, more than I dreamed of before. But, while I'm sure the kids won't have easy, uneventful lives, they (hopefully) won't have many things this difficult. A parent can hope--and yet, should I hope that? I am happy with my growth, with who I am now, and with my acceptance of myself, my strengths and weaknesses and quirks, while still being interested in improving myself more.</span><br><br>
And honestly, I'm LOVING it. Not every moment for sure, but the low points just make the high ones that much higher.<br><br>
And that's what's keeping me going and keeping me calm and zen.<br><br>
I was thinking the other day, about how dh taught me to love, dd is teaching me how to be healthy, and now ds is going to teach me about happiness. And I'd say those are gifts I can pass back to them, but isn't it more about not taking them away?<br><br>
Am I on the same track as what you're thinking about?</div>
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Yeah, I think we're thinking along the same lines.<br><br><br>
... dinner is calling
 

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<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>rainbringer</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/15423387"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I think the message is for all of us, our whole society is that we will have more sick kids, more kids with problems (<b>adults too but it's more noticeable with kids</b>) unless we all change and consider carefully the effects of chemicals we use and depend on, our choices about what foods to eat, etc. These kids are showing us that things need to change. It's easier to make changes to help children, especially our children, than just a vague "it's good for the environment". As autism, ADHD, allergies increase, I believe today's parents and kids will take the world in a more sustainable direction because that is the path to healing.<br><br>
I know dd's illness has given me much greater mindfulness of what we eat and drink. It's overwhelming sometimes and I'm still struggling with it.</div>
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What you've written about is exactly our issue, and one thing I've gained appreciation for, through all this, is how we're interconnected. Both interconnected with the planet, the physical earth around us, but also with people and humanity. I guess that should be obvious, but I've felt somewhat distant in many ways, for a long time and now I have a different sense, sometimes I can almost feel the connectedness.<br><br>
The bold part? That part confuses me, because it really generally seems true. So why not us? Meaning me and my kids, specifically. I got to the point where I could barely work, I did quit my job even though there was nothing about our situation that made that a rational choice. But neither of my kids has ever had nearly enough symptoms for a diagnosis--shadings of lots of things, quirks, health oddities, but that's it. It really seems like this should mean something.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>lolar2</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/15424327"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">To me, illness is a reminder of the wonders and workings of nature and of medicine, and human limitations. I guess that's my spiritual take. I also am a fairly militant (when I have time and energy) disability rights activist.<br><br>
If you ever have a chance to check out the Feminists with Disabilities blog, they sometimes link to different posts and opinions about spirituality and health. Everything from accessibility issues in houses of worship, to ethical questions about assisted suicide.</div>
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I've also regained my sense of wonder, I guess I lost it somewhere along the way, and the joy and beauty in it is very restorative.<br><br>
Thanks for the blog link, I'll check it out.
 

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Jane, so much of our journeys seem to parallel each other, I'm glad you popped in.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>JaneS</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/15427637"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">All I know for sure is that I would never have gotten to the place that I am at now without DS and his allergies and health issues. To be able to heal myself from chronic pain is a tremendous gift and I work hard to continue to see it that way. <b>I have been able to heal much more than the physical, it really has been a culmination of my life thus far, echoing what Shannon has said.</b><br><br><span>Ditto.</span><br><br>
The journey has changed everything about me and my life, for good and bad. It cost me my marriage and I will never have another child.<br><br><span><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"> It seems so unfair, and this is something that's come up for me. Why you and not me? [eta: obviously beyond just *you* because it's taken such a toll on so many marriages, so many families] The stress on my marriage has been rough, I know DH and I have both been very unhappy people for long stretches, but ultimately this has brought us closer together. Maybe it's just that your path has been harder than mine? I think it has been, maybe that's most of the reason there?<br></span><br><br>
Why it happened to me... well I'm not sure sure something like it is not happening to everyone around me. I'm just listening to it differently and am profoundly grateful for that gift. I think everyone learns something from illness.<br><br><span>I see the same thing wrt health issues, but why so much more intense for some than for others? I do wonder, to some extent and in some way, did I invite this into my life? Or accept the work to be done?</span><br><br>
What it means for my son? I don't know, that's a tough one. That's a deeply emotional topic for me. He is going to have a difficult life, and yet, it could be much much worse. He has so much that is amazing and positive and lucky though too. I'm just doing the best I can to help him achieve his potential and his joy.<br><br><span>It sure seems like you've given him a great start, you've given him the gift of being in touch with himself, with how he feels and the knowledge that he can affect that.</span><br><br>
I also have such a deep connection with him. It is completely different than what it would have been if I stayed the person I was, and he was a "normal" child. This has led to healing many hurts that I accumulated in my own childhood.<br><br>
And he will have a very unique perspective on life and health that's for sure!<br><br><br><br>
A bit OT, but I so needed to see this post now to help me focus. I'm completely fed up with not being able to take food into stadiums, theatres, etc! Was treated abominably at the ballpark last weekend. It is just so wrong when food could literally kill my child and they are just protecting their ability to sell their junk (and thus perpetuating one of the causes of the mess our children are in now). I can certainly find meaning now in being hopping mad!<br><br><span>That's frustrating. I haven't encountered that yet, I admit I just use the "we have food allergies" line without getting into the intolerances vs allergies discussion, but you've got a freakin epi-pen! That's just nuts. It sounds like a letter, or a visit, would be in order? I can't believe that management would truly condone not allowing a food-allergic kid to bring in their own food.</span><br><br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/yeahthat.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="yeah that"> well said. <b>I never would have learned this profound perspective on the connection between food, toxins and health without facing these challenges.</b></div>
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Yeah.
 

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Ok, this is pretty bad serial posting, but I don't want to lose my responses, so every time I get up to fiddle with dinner, I hit Submit Reply. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/eyesroll.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="roll"><br><br>
As for why me, why us... in physical terms, I see this same issue affecting people in my family for several generations. In my mom's family, people are getting sicker, but I guess in my dad's, people are less affected (given how messed up grandma was, and dad's way better than either of his parents). I never noticed that before, about my dad's family. Huh.<br><br>
As for theories as to why difficult times come into peoples' lives... I consider myself Christian, albeit with pagan leanings at this point, and the idea of God actively sending trials my way, in order to test or refine me, doesn't sit well. God allowing bad things to happen, either truly bad or difficult but manageable, and helping me through the tough times, that seems more plausible. But still, it comes back to why me? In a spiritual sense, was this necessary as part of my growth? Did I somehow, on some level, know this and decide to take this on? I don't even know how the mechanics of that would work, I see life as a one-shot deal, and after this our spirits move on.<br><br>
I do feel, almost a calling, to share information and support with those going through similar difficulties. As it seems appropriate, in some situations, I feel compelled to share and offer food for thought when people are seeking to understand their situations, and that's a good beyond just my family getting healthier that's come of this. But I'm not sure that's all there is to this.
 

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Sorry for the short post but i highly suggest reading "Healing Our Children" by Ramiel Nigel. Will try to write more later <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/thumb.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="thumbs up">
 

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I'd gotten the impression Nagel's book was mostly about physical health and good nutrition, is there more to it than that?
 
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