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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was going to pm you, but figured there was probably other people who might have something to say about this....<br><br>
I have a post on here about my DS's speech delay. You responded a few days ago about the possibility of autism. I feel bad for admitting this but I didn't respond to it (I was trying to let it sink in, and I wasn't wanting to admit it could be a possibility). Well, now I have another problem and was wondering if you had any experience.<br><br>
A little background... my DS is 24 months and is the sweetest thing. He has always been very active, runs everywhere and doesn't stop. He's always been a happy child and very easy (a few tantrums here and there but generally very happy, he could go weeks without a real tantrum). Other than the speech delay I never had any worries about him developmentally (though other parents have pointed out how active he was, I didn't think that was necessarily a bad thing, kwim?).<br><br>
Anyway, 2 weeks ago today he had a MMR shot. 1 week ago today he started a fever, rash, vomitting, extreme crankiness, horrible tantrums. The rash, fever, and vomitting have all stopped. However, he is an extremely different child now than he was 2 weeks ago. I don't know if he's just not feeling well yet or if something else is going on. He's cranky all the time, throws tantrums for everything and for no reason. He'll just stop what he's doing, throw himself backwards, and bang his head on the ground (today it was the noncarpeted floor at his speech therapists office). The past week he's picked up a habit of lining things up. Dvd's, books, cups from the play kitchen. They all get lined up and they all have to be perfectly straight. He never did this before, I'm not sure if this is just a normal developmental thing that he just got to developmentally or what. This is a complete Jekyl and Hyde. I don't know where this child came from. If I suggest something he'll throw a tantrum. Today it was painting or carving a pumpkin (he loves pumpkins). He started throwing everything in sight, screaming. 2 weeks ago he would have ran over to those pumpkins and been excited about painting one!<br><br>
I probably would have just said all of these things are normal, cranky, 2 year old behavior. But at his speech today his therapist was shocked at his behaviour and said this is not normal 2 year old behaviour, especially given how well behavied he was just 2 weeks ago! She asked if I had taken him to the dr. That worries me. I haven't, but plan on calling him tomorrow.<br><br>
Anyway, I'm basically just grasping at straws here, trying to get any information or opinions on what could be happening. This could just be normal toddler tantrums, right?<br><br>
Thanks for your time <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile">
 

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I understand what you are going through bc my son is going through a similiar situation. We go next week to see a autism dr. to get evaluated. My son changed after he got his MMR shot when he turned 1. He had been saying a few words and regressed. He stopped giving eye contact and became addicted to anything having to do w spinning. There are other things but I want to make it short. You are not alone so never feel that way. I think I need to take my own advice sometimes.
 

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I just got chills and tears. Yeah, it *could* be normal 2 yo toddler stuff, but it *could* also be vaccine injury. Call it in ASAP. Get it documented. I'm sorry if this scares you, but best you investigate every avenue and cover all your bases now. And if you are posting here, you are concerned. Trust your gut. Please, trust your gut. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"> You are not alone.
 

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Steph-<br><br>
I wasn't going to post about that on the other thread. I was pretty sure it would freak you out, as it did me when we received the diagnosis. I was just SO sure we were dealing with *just* a speech delay. Ds1 is friendly, makes eye contact, loves cuddles, a very happy, laid back kid, etc. Basically the same way you describe Owen.<br><br>
Jake never regressed, he still doesn't throw tantrums, he hit all developmental milestones on time.<br><br>
It's possible Owen is just hitting the 'terrible twos', it's possible he's having a vax reaction, it's possible he's had problems all along and now he's getting frustrated at his lack of communication and it's showing itself differently.<br><br>
I didn't want to upset you, and I hope it turns out to be nothing. If it does turn out to be autism, the earlier you get treatment, the better. I think you've already got him in EI, right? Ask for another eval to check for autism if you think that's even a remote possibility. I didn't think it was for us, but when they did the speech eval, he was already 2 1/2, we then met with a psychologist who said we either have hearing loss or autism, tested his ears- perfectly normal, met with psych again, got autism dx. I'm glad they found it, otherwise we wouldn't be in the therapies we are now.<br><br>
It's a VERY overwhelming dx, if that's what it is. Autism isn't only like in the movie 'Rainman' though. There are many, many kids who have it and through early intervention go on to lead perfectly normal, fulfilling lives. I WISH someone (doc, relative, anyone) had mentioned autism as a suspected thing, doc especially!! I would have taken him in for evaluation much sooner than I did. I waited until he was2 1/2 b/c I was pg with ds2, ds1 was 5 weeks early- so I attributed some of his delay to that, and dd was a late talker as well.<br><br>
Don't feel bad about not responding. I understand. It's the fear of 'what if' with the thought of 'that's not possible'. The logical vs the emotional. I still have days that I'm sure 'they're' wrong just as I have days that I know they're right. No matter the dx (or not) he's still the little boy you love, nothing will change that.<br><br>
Keep in mind, we only received a dx in Feb of this year. I don't know much about this yet, I'm still learning. If you want to PM me or post here again, feel free.
 

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Thanks madtan, phishmama, shelbean91. I called DS's doctor today but I don't know what that's actually going to do. I told him everything that's been happening and the first thing out of his mouth was "I don't see how that can be related to the vaccine" <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/jaw2.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="jaw2"> Now, I'm not saying it IS related to the vaccine, but the possibility is there and I know it. I'm also willing to bet that at least the fever and rash he got days 7-10 after the MMR vaccine ARE almost definately related to the vaccine. I obviously can't prove anything else is related to the vaccine, and I doubt his doctor will admit it. I'm going to have to see him face to face to see though. I don't know whether he doesn't want to admit it just yet or what, but he's normally very honest with vaccines (agreed with me about delaying them at least) so we'll see. After I told him about the head banging is when he got concerned. He says all of it could very well be normal 2 year old behaviour. But he wants to see him just to rule out anything physical going on. We go to see him Monday morning.<br><br>
"I think you've already got him in EI, right? Ask for another eval to check for autism if you think that's even a remote possibility."<br><br>
Yes, he's been in EI for 6 months. He just had another eval done late last month (only by the speech therapist though, not by the main coordinator or any other therapists). I'm going to see what his dr says Monday, then talk to his speech therapist Tuesday. From the vibe I got from her she thinks there might be something else going on. She is one of the people who urged me to take DS to the dr. She thinks this goes beyond normal 2 year old tantrums.<br><br>
"we then met with a psychologist who said we either have hearing loss or autism, tested his ears- perfectly normal, met with psych again, got autism dx."<br><br>
That's interesting you mention that. 6 months ago when he had his first eval done he kept failing the hearing screening and doing other things to suggest hearing loss (mainly- ignoring everyone! Not all of the time, but it did, and still does, take an effort sometimes to get his attention). Took him to the ENT and there was nothing physically wrong with his ears (no defects, no fluid, etc). I then took him to an audiologist and had the real hearing test done. His ears are perfectly fine. He just likes to ignore me <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/blahblah.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="blah blah"><br><br>
Can I ask, shelbean91, why your DS was diagnosed with autism? What is it that makes them believe that's what it is? I'm just curious because I'm having a hard time wrapping my brain around the fact that such a happy, laid back child could have autism. (That sounds like I'm questioning whether your DS has autism.... I want to be clear that I am not doing that! Just can't make the words come out right.... I am questioning how *my* child can go from being such a happy child to being.... this.) It's just not what I imagine when I hear the word "autism", kwim?<br><br>
He did actually have a few good moments today, which of course made me question whether it's all in my head and I shouldn't have called the doctor. I guess I am just hoping that by the time Monday comes along DS is back to his normal, happy, laid back self. I'll still go to his dr appointment, just so I can make sure it all goes in his chart and talk to his dr about it. I'm just going to feel like a moron if I go all the way to the dr just to have him tell me my child is a tantruming 2 year old and that's it. I'll be greatly relieved. But a little embarrased that I needed a doctor to tell me that <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/shy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="innocent">
 

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Steph-<br><br>
I completely understand your question. I've asked myself that many, many times. I still haven't completely wrapped my head around it, don't know if I ever will, but it's where I am for now. BTW, I'm not going to be on MDC for the next several days- I've got a TON of homework, but if you'd like to email me, you can link through my profile- please feel free, I check it several times a day. (I wouldn't say it if I didn't mean it.)<br><br>
What makes them think he's got autism: lack of speech, lack of ability to follow simple directions such as 'get your shoes' or 'come here', doesn't respond to his name, generally is social and affectionate, but only on his terms, high need for sensory input- he jumps a lot, throws stuff in the air and watches it fall, swings and slides over and over, FREAKS out when the vacuum cleaner is brought our, FREAKS out at any sort of dr/dentist office, even if not for him, etc.<br><br>
Now, any one of those things by itself wouldn't necessarily be a concern, but when they're put all together- that's how they come up with the dx. When I was reading online info about autism - I kept reading the checklists and saying 'nope, that's not him' over and over. The little quirky things he does/did were just HIM, being himself- his normal, laid back, happy self. But, they explained some of the little quirky things actually fit into those categories, without me knowing it.<br><br>
At this point, if the autism dx is wrong, I'd be completely thrilled. But, that label is what is allowing us to get OT, speech, music therapy, habilitation and respite care paid for by the state. He's also got state insurance secondary to our regular insurance, so I have no copays for him. All that therapy can only help. I'd rather take the label in error and get more help that resist the label and not get the therapies (which run at least $100/hr- one I think is billed at $180/hr).<br><br>
The thing that makes autism SO hard for me, is the fact that there are NO absolutes. Each manifestation of the disease is different- it's called Autism Spectrum Disorder- so it can range from very mild to very severe. No 2 kids have the exact same set of symptoms. Most days, I feel we got off pretty easy. The things that scare me is that boys are much more likely to have it, and if you have one child with it, other kids have a much higher percent chance of also having it. Fortunately, my youngest is showing NO symptoms.<br><br>
I don't know what causes. I don't know for sure it's vax's. I don't know for sure it's not. I wonder if I ate too much tuna when I was pg. Drank too much caffiene. Didn't sleep enough. Did too much exercise, not enough. He had jaundice when he was 10 days old- bad enough to be hospitalized- did that cause it? If I caught the jaundice earlier, would it have been prevented? I ask myself these things every day. I try not to dwell on it. It's very, very hard. There aren't many people who can relate- they either think it's no big deal or they think it's a death sentence.<br><br>
I think you need to get your peace of mind. Talk to the doc- but know he will NOT say the vax caused it, NEVER, EVER will the doc said it was caused by a vax. Visit the vax board for some ideas and suggestions, but from what I recall - MMR reaction 7-10 days later is quite normal (though vax knowledge isn't my thing). Get the evals- hopefully you will find out you've got a tantruming toddler and you've been overreacting. It's better to overreact than under react.<br><br>
Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks Michelle <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/thanks.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="thanks"> My online time is actually going to take a dive too. DS and I are moving Monday and won't have internet access. So I'll have to go to dad's house whenever I want to come chat <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/wink1.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="wink1"> I will update later after I talk to his dr and the therapists. Thanks again for all your responses!
 

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Hi Steph&Owen<br><br>
I know you didn't ask my advice. My one word to you would be to get away from your pediatrician and get another one who knows something aobut autism and someone who is willing to admit that vaccines cause children injury.<br><br>
Please get away from this doctor, as you have no chance of getting an honest assessment from him, and your son deserves and immediate, true evaluation and diagnosis. Your son may not be autistic, but if he is, you want professionals around him who will diagnose and treat progressively.<br><br>
I know it is hard, and the automatic response is to go to denial... as hard as it is please keep your mind open so your son can be treated if he is autistic. I get so many emails from anguished parents whose children have been autistic since 2 years... and they couldn't admit it until the children were in 5th or 6th grade - just a week ago a 16 year old - and there is nothing to be done now.<br><br>
Just stay open and get another doc.<br><br>
Good luck.
 
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