[MaryTheres]

Okay so I have had it with preschool/daycare. Perhaps, it is extra hard for me to get used to since he has been with me (and his grandmother 2 days a week) for the past three years and I am just not used to group care. I don't know. I am just wondering how much I should let slide.

DS is three (turned three September 4th). I started him in daycare/preschool three days a week in September b/c I went back to work full-time to save up some extra money for the new baby who will be here April 2nd (I plan to be home full time then and will take DS out of the preschool/daycare program then). It is a university run lab pre-school. It is naeyc accredited and has a four star rating on keystone stars (highest rating). The pre-school teacher has her master in education and has been teaching there 15 years. I like all of those things and I do like the main teacher very much. I also like most of the university students that intern there in the afternoon (particularly the one assigned to my son's class. DS is dropped off at around 8:30am and I try like hell to get there at 4pm to pick him up (but most days I do not get there until 4:15pm).

Here are the problems. The first problem was forcing the nap-time. I sorted that one out but it took a bit of fight and a meeting with the director and teacher. DS was so angry and his behaviour was deteriorating incredibly. He acted out so much when I would pick him up I hardly recognized him (he was hitting me, picking fights with me, melting down and just being incredibly oppositional). Fortunately, he is very very verbal and the problem was was that they were forcing him to nap at rest time (2 hours) He told me the teacher's assistant, Ms. Jen (who I do not like, more about her later), would "push him down at nap time" (I think forcefully lay him down rather than push). He told us repeatedly that he was scared of rest time. Even if he didn't sleep, they would make him lay on his mat for two hours. I gave it a month their way and then I had to put my foot down. I told them if this continued I would have to take him out. He can not be forced to sleep and he cannot be forced to lay on a mat for 2 hours. I told them I think you should make him rest for 20 minutes and then if he is not asleep he needs to be allowed up and OFF OF HIS MAT to play quietly. The director argued with me trying to say his behavoir was due to the fact that DH and I are too lenient! But I really stuck to my guns (I know my child!!). An Immediately after the conference when they changed the way they deal with nap-time, DS' behavour was completely back to normal . Now he even sleeps for them alot. As long as he knows he is not being forced he is fine, he plays quietly and then often will go lay own on his own accord for a rest and then naps for an hour or more. I was so very right and he is back to his old self.

So, other problems. Free time between 4pm and 6pm - the teachers go home at this time and it is just the teacher assistants. Most of the 'teacher assistants,' in my opinon, leave much to be desired they are super young (early twenties at the most) and my impression is that they want to chit-chat at this time and not be too bothered with the children. Now that the weather is not so good, they show movies at this time between 4pm and 6pm out of laziness, in my opinon. And very often, it seems. They are showing Disney Movies. One night I was not able to get there to get DS until 5pm and I walked in to find about four children from DS' class standing outside a classroom that was showing a movie. They all know me and immediately announced to me that they "were scared of the beast." Just at that point one of the assistants came out and said to them "oh it's not scary. it's Beauty and the Beast!" complete with an eye roll as she ushered them back into the classroom. Inside the movie, Ben sat holding the hand of one of his girlfriends (cute little girl about a year or so older than him that loves to mommy him) - he told me he was so scared of the beast (it just happened to be a very scary part where the princess or whatever she is finds the beast and he shouldn't have or something and the beast is roaring and yelling at her). I took him out to go get his things and he was really upset saying that the beast would now come in his dreams, etc. Then, upon no provocation from me, he marched his little bottom back into where the movie was showing and told Miss Jasmine that she "should not be showing that movie to children, the beast will come in their dreams!" LOL. I never complained but, apparantly, DS complained again to his teacher the next day. So last week, I picked him up and he was in another classroom crying while all the kids from his classroom were watching "Alladin." Apparently, they had seperated him from his class, b/c after his complaints about Beauty and the Beast, they thought Alladin would be too scary for him. But he was super upset at having been sperated from his classmates ("friends"). So, now, he's upset at that. I mean should educators being showing these movies to three-yearolds in the first place? A bunch of very different, young children with different sensitivities? Some of the movies are scary for DS and some he may be fine with but why bother with the movies at all? either way, he is very sad - either he gets to stay with friends and potentially be scared and have bad dreams or he is ostracized from his friends while they all go watch the movie. My mom's school (alos naeyc and 4 stars) does not do movies or TV - they have a "no movie or tv policy" - mom says her director believes there is no place for that stuff at a schools and that they (even teacher assistants) should be "working and interacting with the children at all times" not sticking them in front of a movie screen (of course her school also has a a gym inside the school for free play during inclement weather, DS' school does not).

Honestly, I want to complain about the movie situation. I just don't think it is appropriate (I also think it shows a huge lack of common sense, personally). Should I? Or should I just leave it? I am taking him out in April. On the other hand I am paying close to $200 per week for this crap. and that kind-of pisses me off - that's alot of money for them to be showing him disney movies for a couple fo hours a day.

The other thing is the teacher's assistant for my son's classroom, Ms. Jen. While I love Ms. Maureen, his teacher. I have to say I can not stand Miss Jen. She is sooo a bitchy to the children. She doens't do anything super bad that I have noticed but she is just not warm or nice. My husband noticed it too. He hates when he drops DS before Ms. Maureen arrives because he says Ms. Jen just sits at her desk on her computer yelling at the children. Shoudl I complain about her?

If I should complain about htese things - any suggestions on how to do so would be appreciated .

Thanks so much and sorry for the 'novel' here.

 

[Caneel]

My 3 yo DS had a nap struggle too. At his center (v. similar to yours and I am also in PA, does the university begin with an S?) children who don't sleep are allowed to play quietly away from the rest of the group. I can't believe your DS is the first child to not want to lay on his mat for two hours. Their attitude on this subject is poor. I am glad to hear they changed their ways. I also would have been upset.

The movies? I think this is horrible! Does the director know what is going on? I can't believe they get away with this. I would definately say something.

I would also discuss the Ms. Jen thing with the director. She should not be yelling at the children, period. If she doesn't have the personality/temperment to work with children, she shouldn't be there.

 

[Merilin]

Remembering my childhood movie experiences: I was completely freaked out and had nightmares after watching Disney's snowhite at the age of 5 1/2. It was mostly the dwarfs that terrified me, I ran out the movie theater and did not even see much of the evil hag.

Having 3 year olds watch movies like that is completely unacceptable IMHO. There might be kids who can handle it, but I would guess they watch these at home and are more used to it. I even remember, that a lot of these movies in my home country were rated R-6, meaning kids under 6 should not watch these.

Considering, that you plan on leaving this place behind anyways, I would definitely complain to make the next couple months easier for your child.

 

[2xy]

I saw Dumbo when I was four or so, and was terrified of the whale!

 

[MaryTheres]

Thanks, Caneel. No, it's the lab pre-school at Widener University. Anyway, thanks for your response... it's hard because I don't want to be a 'pill' and I realize I am just a little bit different than the mainstream (with the attachment parenting philosophy) so sometimes I am not so sure if I am completely justified in what I find appalling or what! I try to just avoid the issues (like we try to drop him off after when we know ms. maureen tends to arrive and I try to pick him up by 4pm then I can avoid the whole 'movie/free play/no teachers' situation that I dislike. But it gets hard - DH is often late for work and I have to leave work by 3:30pm to get DS (I try to get in by 7:30am so I can do this).

Anyway, I am not sure if the director know about the movie sitch - good point .... she is very rarely there at that time of day. I think I may bring it up nochantly like ask her if movie day usually fridays or what, tell her that I need to know 'cause I am trying to avoid that situation and why, and then also bring up some whether she is aware fo the issues/problems surronding routinely showing disney movies to pre-schoolers (whether as an educator she really thinks it's a good idea?) As for ms. jen I think I will just flat out complain about her.

 

[MaryTheres]

Thanks Ladies, good to hear I am not 'crazy' re the movie situation. I doubt myself too much

 

[CarrieMF]

There are probably alot of those kids who watch those same movies at home. I wouldn't go in & complain about the movies, but go in & suggest that they set up other things for kids to do if they don't want to watch the movies. I'm not sure how the room is set up but they could easily have stations set up, movies in 1 corner, puzzles in another, etc.

The biggest reason why I wouldn't complain about the movies is that your son is usually there for 15 minutes during this time 5 of that they should be getting his stuff ready to leave.

I would talk to the teacher & get her input, they may not realize how often the movies are being shown.

The nap thing is settled & over.

As for the TA, what exactly are you going to complain about? You can't really go in complaining, you need to suggest some solutions too. What would you like to change about her?

For both of these issues you need to talk to the teachers first as they are the ones in charge of & responsible for the TA's.

 

[MaryTheres]

Honestly, Carrie, it would be nice not to have to stress myself out trying to get there before 4pm - i.e., before the movies... it's hard. I am 5 1/2 months pregnant and it's hard to get in every day by 7:30am so that I am can leave in enough time to get him by 4pm. I get really stressed out when I get stuck in traffic, etc. b/c I don't like what goes on there after 4pm. and there are times when I simply cannot leave to get him by 4pm - it would be nice to feel a bit more comfortable about the kind of care he is receiving. I really do not think they should be showing them at all. At the very least, I think maybe if they only show them, they should show them only on certain days (like fridays or something) ... at least I can try my hardest to get someone else to watch him on those days. Or maybe only the older kids (which is what the piolicy seemed to be before this (the four year olds and five year olds seem fine with the movies as far as I can see). Also, it wasn't just my son that was scared of the movie - 4 other children in his age group were also scared so just goes to show it is probably pretty safe to asssume that generally these movies are not acceptable for three-year olds. So, I do think I will approach it the way I described in my last post.

As for ms. jen, she shouldn't be working with children if she can't be nice to them, sorry. I will definitely complain about her ( I just couldn't decide whether to do it now or when I take DS out) but seems beeds to complain about her. She needs to adjust her atttitude or not be working there anymore. Perhaps, my complaint alone will not do much but fi others complain...eventually someone will take it seriously.

 

[Cuau]

What Carrie is saying is right, you have to suggest solutions too.

That being said I would be really annoyed if at the dc they showed a movie that was scaring my dd. I have a 2yr girl and she is very sensitive to movies. If someone is taking care of her they should be paying attention to her reaction. Not chit-chating away while the kids watch the movie. So yeah I wuold say something.

 

[MisaGoat]

I am surprised they are showing movies at daycare/preschool. I was a teacher assistant in a 3-5 year old room before I had my son and we never showed movies. I don't think we even had a tv there. I allow my son to watch tv/movies at home but I would be upset if the time he was at daycare/preschool was spent watching tv/movies.

I am also surprised that Ms. Jen sits on a computer or at a desk while she is responsible for children. There wasn't a desk in the classroom or computer. We each had one hour a week of prep/planning time to take care of paperwork/training etc. If we needed more we might do it during nap time.

In the afternoons I do remember being tired and wanting to chat but that was usually done while sitting at the table with children doing puzzles or coloring. The afternoon free time time when the children were being picked up was spent doing table time (table toys like puzzles, legos, coloring) and having a snack.

How long has ms. Jen been at the center? Is this a requirement for school? Some people do not have the patience for children or have unreasonable expectations of young children. Our center had a fairly high turnover of people that didn't stay very long, some only stayed a few days or weeks. I only stayed 6 months or so and I love children. Some of the people I worked with were wonderful and some were not so great but almost all the teacher assistants were in their late teens/young twenties.

 

[One_Girl]

I think you should complain about the seperation from the class, the movie time, and the hands off care your son is getting from the assistant teacher and the student interns. Have a sit down conference with the lead teacher on her own first and talk to her about your concerns and then go to the director if it doesn't change quickly. Because this is a university the director is also under someone and you can go to his supervisor if you need to. Quality care does not include a movie on a daily or even weekly basis and there should not even be a desk or computer in the classroom nor should there be adult furniture in a preschool class at all. The teachers should be on the floor participating in play or at least available for play except when they are setting up for meals and snack.

 

[MaryTheres]

Okay, I will go to the teacher first. I like her better than the director anyway (although I like the director well enough). I will just sit and discuss my concerns and see what her thoughts are - not adversarial but more alerting her to the situation/issues, seeing how much she is aware of, her thoughts and discussing some changes. Now that I think about it, I am somewhat confident she will at least be open to my concerns (I mean movies/tv is not usually highly favored among the educators and this woman is a highly educated educator herself). Perhaps, the movie thing is just getting out of hand and she isn't aware of that. And perhaps there were/are limitations on the movies and the TAs are just starting to ignore them. I don't know and I should know before I go raising around the roof! I will mention Ms. jens attitude as well and see what her thoughts are.

Incidently, both the TA and the teacher have a desk with a computer. I thought that was a bit different also. My mom has no desk nor her own computer at her school - there is a 'community one' that the teachers use occassionally but it is not in their classrooms..... she said the same thing. Sure, it's a hard job but that is their job interacting with the children not stickng them in front of a movie screeen or plopping themselves in front of a computer. Also, incidently, my mom's school's TAs are some young and some older women. I have spent time at my mom's school and have met everyone. But I think her director is really the driving force behind why the school is so good - like I said, she is very anti-forcing children to sleep, anti-tv, anti-movie, anti-punishment. And my mom says she'll frire you on the spot she catches you do anything. That's an exaggeration though - she warns you once, then she fires you and she is there watching so no one really pulls any crap. She also has alll the ta's trained regularly. I wish I could have sent him there but it is an an hour away ;-( and would never have worked with where we live and work.

Honestly, this whole situation is making very bitter and anti-daycare. seriously. I visited a number of places and this was the best one I thought. And even this one does things I would have never expected a naeyc university-run place to do! seriously. At this point, I positively HATE that I have to send my DS there and I can't wait till it is over. I am praying that by the time I have to go back to work full-time after my next one that my MIL is available on a more full time basis. It's a shame, if they had done a better a job I would have kept DS there for pre-k and sent my next one there as well. Not now. I don't think it is the worst place, of course, but I am greatly disappointed and would not have my DS there is I had a choice in the matter.

 

[Evan&Anna's_Mom]

Over the years I have had several issues with various things at preschool. I agree with the PP that suggested that you start with the teacher rather than the director. Make an appointment to speak with her and state your concerns. Potential solutions are always good.

Personally, I think you are completely within reason to suggest that movies be eliminated except in extraordinary circumstances (day 4 of no recess due to bad weather, teacher shortage due to flu epidemic, that sort of thing). Our preschool showed movies rarely. When they did show them they posted the movie title the day before so parents who objected could make that known, and they always had an alternative activity planned if there were objections. I think this is the very least that I would accept as a solution -- your ability to arrive early and remove your child before a specific movie was shown.

Absolutely you should mention lack of warm and interaction on the part of the asst. teacher. Especially if this is behavior that is mostly evident when the main teacher and/or director aren't there. They won't know unless you tell them. I actually had a teacher dismissed because of her interaction with children that I observed while waiting to pick up my child one day. You are right, preschool teachers should be warm and visably enjoy working with children. Everyone is entitled to a bad day, but if you see this more often then not you should definitely mention it. Request that the teacher or director observe the asst. more frequently / unobtrusively and offer feedback. At least as the first step.

There are certain things that you end up compromising on with group care, I think that no center coud do things "perfectly" for all the parents involved. But the things that you describe shouldn't be among them and have easy solutions.

 

[rabbitmum]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaryTheres would not have my DS there is I had a choice in the matter.

Neither would I, it sounds awful.

I'm sorry you have to deal with this. Your son sounds like he is very good at stating his opinion, though!

I can't see how showing films in daycare can be acceptable at all. Especially to three-year-olds! Also I don't think you should be responsible for suggesting solutions - you don't work there, and it should be up to the supposed professionals who, after all, work for you, to provide good and age-appropriate care for your son.

 

[bnhmama]

This is Naeyc's accreditation standards.
http://www.naeyc.org/academy/standards/

It's been awhile since I reviewed accred. standards but I can promise you daily movie viewing is NOT acceptable. Nor is being bitchy or perching at a desk and yelling at the kids. She should be on the floor, with the children, moving around the room supervising, talking to them, etc.

Rolling eyes and dismissing the kids claims of being scared is so infuriating. Yes, I would complain.

What you are describing is not acceptable by NAEYC standards and possibly not by local licensing standards. (THe movies, the assitant's demeanor towards the children.) I would read and possibly print the NAEYC standards and then have a meeting with the Director. Let her know you chose this center because NAEYC has excellent standards (among other reasons) and you feel like it's not happening. The daily movies, Disney movies at that, is apalling.

When I directed, we RARELY used the tv and when we did, we were only allowed (per state accred. standards) to show something that could be considered "educational."

Also, the segregation of your son is outrageous. Yeah, I'd be making some noise.

As a general rule, you should not have to feel like you are rescuing your child at the end of the day.

 

[bnhmama]

I found this regarding passive media usage.

http://www.naeyc.org/academy/standar...standard2H.asp

Item 2.H.01

Certainly open to interpretation but these films are CLEARLY not appropriate for an entire class of 3 y/o children.

Bottom line: You are paying for quality care and you are not receiving this service. Quality does not equal bitchy teachers rolling their eyes and playing inappropriate movies every day.

 

[CarrieMF]

Quote:

Honestly, Carrie, it would be nice not to have to stress myself out trying to get there before 4pm - i.e., before the movies... it's hard. I am 5 1/2 months pregnant and it's hard to get in every day by 7:30am so that I am can leave in enough time to get him by 4pm. I get really stressed out when I get stuck in traffic, etc. b/c I don't like what goes on there after 4pm. and there are times when I simply cannot leave to get him by 4pm - it would be nice to feel a bit more comfortable about the kind of care he is receiving. I really do not think they should be showing them at all.

I understand this, but my point was since your son is usually there for 15 minutes during this time that it may not be taken as seriously as if it was a child who's there for the entire 2 hours. I also stated talking to the teacher as she may not be aware this is happening the entire time each day or to suggest alternative activities that they could be doing at the same time as the movie for kids who don't want to watch the movie.

complaining about the ta after you pull your son out is useless. You won't be there to see if anything changes, they may think that if you had a real problem with it you would have brought it up before & not after.

 

[Sasharna]

Even if you choose to approach the teacher about most of the troubles, I would still recommend that you let the director know you're heavily disappointed that the center is not living up to NAEYC standards.

Also, please be aware of the fact that google is a very powerful tool. You've listed the teachers' names as well as the location of the center. You may want to edit out this information, to protect your privacy.

 

[BoringTales]

Its a Disney Movie...typical 3 year olds shouldn't be scared of Disney Movies. They are pretty tame. I wouldn't complain. Really, it seems like you are just looking for reasons. It isn't fair for you to expect them to change their whole program because you have issues. If its not a good fit for him, look into moving him elsewhere. I don't think you'll ever find a care center you are happy with though. You'd be better off finding an at-home, homeschooling mom who would be willing to watch him and keep him occupied while you need to be away. That sounds like it would better suit your sensibilities.

 

[lolar2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoringTales Its a Disney Movie...typical 3 year olds shouldn't be scared of Disney Movies. They are pretty tame. I wouldn't complain. Really, it seems like you are just looking for reasons. It isn't fair for you to expect them to change their whole program because you have issues. If its not a good fit for him, look into moving him elsewhere. I don't think you'll ever find a care center you are happy with though. You'd be better off finding an at-home, homeschooling mom who would be willing to watch him and keep him occupied while you need to be away. That sounds like it would better suit your sensibilities.

The center is accredited by NAEYC and the frequent showing of movies is inconsistent with those standards. That is not acceptable.