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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am pregnant with my third child. My OB has said he will not allow me to attempt a VBA2C. So far I have not been successful in finding a new provider; the only recommendations I have gotten are for the doctor I already have. On the whole, I am satisfied with my OB. I have seen him for 8 years, and he performed one of my sections.

My OB has no problem with waiting until labor begins or I'm past my EDD to do a repeat section. If I am not able to find a VBA2C-supportive provider, what will happen if I show up to the hospital in labor and refuse the repeat at that point? How difficult would that be?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I guess I feel like I need the "safety net" of a hospital delivery. The closest hospital is more than half an hour away, and with a volunteer rescue squad there could be a considerable wait. It seems like too much of a risk to be that far away in case of an emergency.
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by *ami* View Post
I guess I feel like I need the "safety net" of a hospital delivery. The closest hospital is more than half an hour away, and with a volunteer rescue squad there could be a considerable wait. It seems like too much of a risk to be that far away in case of an emergency.
I know what you mean. I felt the same way for a while, but more and more times I've ready stories about women attempting VBAC who were sectioned, while in labor or a almost there.
But that's exactly what I'd do if I were in your shoes.

Good luck.
 

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When I was considering a VBAcC, I asked that question of an OB (not my own) and he told me that if I showed up pushing, or really any time in labor, that I could refuse a c-section. He said that a c-section without consent is assault with a deadly weapon and that no dr would do it.

Of course, the hospital staff and doctors would not have to like it and I'm sure that you would be pressured in every way possible to consent to the c-section.
 

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Did you check the ican website? Have you contacted every hospital to see if you can find one that is VBAC friendly, teaching hospitals are best.

If you have the resolve you can refuse anything and everything including being cut open again. I personally would not stay with an OB that told me he would not "allow" me to VBAC. Oh HELLLLLLL No
 

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When faced with a similar situation, I considered this option, but decided that I could not labor and fight medical staff at the same time. That was probably one of the reasons I had the surgery last time.

In the end I chose to birth at a freestanding birth center in a city about 80 mi away. I went to the bc pretty early in labor, but came and went all day, out to eat, walk in the park, etc. It was a really awesome labor and I wouldn't consider birthing anywhere else.

One option, if you choose a hospital or bc farther away, would be to check into a hotel near the hospital for early labor.

I'd be very careful about believing what your OB says about refusing surgery. It's not unusual for MDs to change their tune late in pregnancy, and if he's not available when the baby comes, there's no telling what kind of attitude the on-call OB will have. It HAS been known to happen that a woman is sectioned against her will. Other women have been harassed, threatened, and had their support people turned against them in order to coerce them to sign consent forms. Going in pushing would be a last resort, but it would NEVER be my first choice.

Whatever you choose, please get a doula! That could make all the difference.
 

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no woman should ever been forced into surgery against her will, but it has happened. I also encourage you to show up with a doula and as many support people (witnesses) as possible so that when you refuse the section there are a number of people to repeat "She said no." But I wouldn't wait until labor to refuse. When you are over 36 weeks, write a detailed letter to the hospital stating that you are birthing there in (month) and you are refusing a repeat c-section, and you want to make sure that all potential staff that could be caring for you are aware in advance that you are refusing a repeat section.
Most doctors would not drop a woman after 36 weeks, but even if your doctor threatened to drop you, the hospital cannot deny you care if you show up in labor - they must take you.

Suggested information to include:

I
am planning a vaginal birth at (hospital) sometime in (month). I have had two previous c-sections, and
have decided, after reviewing all of the medical literature, that a VBAC
birth is safer for me than scheduling a cesarean section. I have received
excellent prenatal care during my pregnancy, and I have been looking very
forward to my VBAC birth at (hospital). I sincerely hope that you will
support and assist me in having the best vaginal birth possible. I am
writing to request a meeting to review the following things:

1. I want to ensure that the VBAC policy at (hospital) is supportive
of VBAC births and the rights of pregnant women to make their own birth
choices.

2. I want to request that (hospital) draft a formal policy statement
that under no circumstances would staff pressure or coerce a woman to
undergo a cesarean if she has made an informed refusal for surgery - in
other words, it is important that there is no policy stating that women with
more than one c-section are "restricted" from having a vaginal birth.

3. I want my medical record at (hospital) to be clearly marked that
I have already made a fully informed choice to refuse a cesarean, and that I
do not intend to argue or fight with staff about a cesarean when I arrive in
labor to vaginally deliver my baby.

4. I want the enclosed medical literature showing that a VBAC birth
after multiple cesarean sections is safe (my risk of uterine rupture is less
than 1% if I am not induced), and that my risks from a third cesarean are
high, making a cesarean risky and dangerous for me to be placed in my chart
so that all hospital personnel assisting with my VBAC know that I have been
fully informed of my risks. I am truly scared of the risks of a third
cesarean, my risk of death is much higher with a cesarean than with a
vaginal birth, and I cannot undertake this risk for me or for my other
children unless some emergency warrants it (cord prolapsed, placental
abruption, etc.). It is my hope that if the staff understands my concerns,
everyone will work with me to ensure I have the best vaginal birth possible.

I thank you very much for your time in reviewing the enclosed literature and
for considering my concerns.
I hope that once we meet, I can rest assured that policies are in place
that support a woman's right to VBAC, and that no woman will have to face
pressure to have a cesarean after they have made an informed refusal for
surgery. After knowing that (hospital) will be supportive of my VBAC, I
will be able to just focus on having a healthy pregnancy and preparing for
my upcoming vaginal birth at (hospital). I appreciate you
making time in your busy schedule to discuss my concerns, and working with
me to ensure I have the best birth possible at (hospital).

Sincerely,

Here is the suggested literature to include:

http://medicalcenter.osu.edu/patient...press/?ID=2835

http://www.greenjournal.org/cgi/cont...tract/108/1/21

Please also send a copy of your letter to ACOG, asking them to take action to put an end to unethical VBAC "bans." ACOG is reading letters being sent. Please make sure they hear from you:

Douglas H. Kirkpatrick, MD, President

The American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists
PO Box 96920
Washington, DC 20090-2188
 

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Yes, you have the legal right to refuse the c/s even if you're not pushing. Check out section 4 of the EMTALA FAQ here. (basically a hospital has to take a woman in active labor, but they don't have to take a woman who isn't... so showing up pushing is still a good idea.) I've known mamas who labored in a minivan in the hospital parking lot so they could essentially walk in crowning. There is a nice article about EMTALA rights and cesarean avoidance on the ICAN site here as well (parts get a bit technical/legal jargon thought).

There have been cases of hospitals getting court orders to force a c/s. More recently though there have been cases of the courts awarding damages for wrongful c/s so it may be a hospital will be more cautious about just calling the court. Even if they don't call the courts or CPS, there is a good chance they will try to pressure you to agree to the rc/s. You'll need to be very clear, and have very clear support people with you, since you'll want to focus on your birth... not on a fight.

A woman in my region brought a signed, notorized, letter from her lawyer that basically said she'd press charges if anything was done without her express consent. This may seem extreme, but she had her vbac.

Happy birthing... I hope everything goes well!
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks for the advice.

I looked into a homebirth midwife practice, but I'm not sure we would be able to handle the payment terms. We would have to pay everything upfront, then submit for partial insurance reimbursement after the baby is born. I'm also still concerned about how far away our home is from the hospital.

I would have 100% insurance coverage for a hospital birth. My husband wants me to discuss the issue with my OB again. My OB quoted rupture statistics that seem way too high (5%, or 1 in 20). Are there any studies or organizations that promoted such high chances of rupture?
 

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I don't know where your OB is getting his stats, but UR rates are nowhere near that high for either single or multiple previous cesareans, provided you don't have a classical incision. In one recent study, the UR rate was 0.9% among women doing VBAMCs, versus 0.7% among women with just one previous cesarean, and that difference was not statistically significant. Read the abstract here.

It's also important to consider that each repeat cesarean carries escalating risks to the mother--the more cesareans, the higher the risks--while repeat VBACs become successively safer.

I would bring these in and discuss them with your OB. I suspect that his recommendations are motivated by malpractice insurance and pressure from colleagues to adhere to a certain "standard of care," not because the medical literature shows a significantly elevated risk of UR with a history of two cesareans.
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by wombatclay View Post

A woman in my region brought a signed, notorized, letter from her lawyer that basically said she'd press charges if anything was done without her express consent. This may seem extreme, but she had her vbac.

Happy birthing... I hope everything goes well!
Doesn't seem extreme at all. Really it seems like it could be more dangerous to show up during pushing, I doubt it could happen but what if they went to do c/s and had to push the baby back in? Why do you think pushing the baby out is so much more dangerous then labour?
 

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Yeah, unless you push the baby out in 15 minutes, they could still take you back to the OR. For my c/s, I pushed for 2 1/2 hours before I consented to the c/s...in my vbac's, I pushed for 1 1/2 hours. Would have been plenty of time for a cut.

Good luck. I know it's tough. If you think you're a fighter in labor, then I would try it, but I'm not a fighter...in labor. If it were me, I'd go out of town for my birth. Come to st. louis! We have many docs that will take vba2c. Keep us posted!
 

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I know it seems a little extreme. But, if a VBAC means a lot to you I would consider traveling for the birth. I also live in a rural area and the local hospital has a ban on VBACs. The nearest hospital that will let you try a VBAC is over 2 hours away. I was uncomfortable with the drive so I found a rental through craigslist and booked it for a few weeks before the delivery.

Having support through l&d is important and you don't want to slow your labor while you fight against a c/s with an unsupportive OB.

I know some people who live far from a good provider head towards the hospital as soon as they know they are in labor and get a hotel room close to the hospital to labor in until they are ready for birth.

Good luck deciding what to do. I hope that you find a way to surround yourself with love and support in your next birth, however you do it.
 
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