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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
this has been going on for about 1.5 years. dd will be 5 in a month. about 1-2 hours after she falls asleep she starts bouts of crying. she would cry/scream and kick her legs for about 10 sec, then be quiet for about 5 minutes, then the cycle continues. it usually lasts about 1 hour. sometimes she cries for longer, sometimes she has more intensity, and screams and kicks and tries to hurt me (what we call a night time tantrum). sometimes she is responsive, and if i ask her whether she wants to nurse, she will say YES eagerly and nurse, but this won't necessarily stop the cycle. sometimes she doesn't seem to hear me. sometimes she talks in her sleep, things like 'it is falling', or 'don't do this', or 'i don't want this' -- and it seems she is having nightmares.<br><br>
my responses have ranged from: being very soothing; telling her firmly that nights are for sleeping / it is a dream, mama is here (sort of trying to hypnotise her <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lol"> ); rubbing her back; picking her up and gently shaking her; blowing on her face; shifting her position; saying nothing and doing nothing. nothing seems to have an effect.<br><br>
in the morning she says she slept well. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/dizzy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Dizzy">: if i don't cue her in any way, she won't say anything about bad dreams, but if i ask her if she had any bad dreams, she will readily agree, but she never provides details, and i have a feeling that i am searching for an explanation and is happy to give me one. so i don't think she remembers much. sometimes she says that animals were eating her.<br><br>
usually she has several weeks off, when she sleeps through, or almost through the night, alternating with longer periods of this very restless sleep.<br><br>
i think that she is in between of nightmares and night terrors, if this makes sense.<br><br>
i used to be very anxious about it, but in the last year i've been very zen, as i realised that DS is not affected on most of the night. we all cosleep. but i am affected. i don't get much sleep. it is frustrating, and emotionally exhausting and sometimes infuriating, even if i logically know that she is not doing this on purpose. sometimes i just want to yell JUST SLEEP. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/redface.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Embarrassment"><br><br>
one thing that i noticed, she has more distress when her breathing is compromised with a stuffy nose. this got me thinking, whether this could be related to breating. she was diagnosed with viral asthma 3 years ago. she hasn't had any symptoms in the last year, and even in the first 2 years after the diagnosis she would only get mild coughs with colds. no wheezing, no respiratory distress. but a tibetan healer that i was seeing then said that breathing difficulties are detectable only when they reach a certain percentage, and one can have them, but they won't be noticeable. so maybe she is reacting to this? but why then this would come and go? she is healthy otherwise. she IS sensitive.<br><br>
this latest cycle has been lasting for about 7 weeks. i hope that after posting this the mdc fairy will come and stop the cycle, forever and ever (or is this too much to ask?)<br><br>
we don't have access to a naturopath; we do have access to a herbalist.<br><br>
please help us. this has been so disturbing, i actually got up now, after staying next to her for 1 hour, to write this post. i am wide awake. and anxious too.
 

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DS has had night terrors since he was about a year old, and it took me a couple years to realize that his are definitely related to his allergies. The better we are able to control those, the less often he has them. But there was one point that he'd have them every night. It's heartbreaking to watch, and we've never found anything that could make it better once one starts. We've done everything you're doing... DH lost his mind the first time he saw one, and I wasn't home to handle it. It's pretty scary.<br><br>
I'm sorry I don't have any tried and true help for you, but I think you're on the right track linking this to her breathing. DS's episodes usually happen when he's congested or has been exposed to an allergen. I hope you both sleep better tonight!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·

DS has had night terrors since he was about a year old, and it took me a couple years to realize that his are definitely related to his allergies. QUOTE]<br><br>
she was tested when she was 2, and she had no allergies then, and she doesn't seem to have any allergies, at least not manifested.<br><br>
can one have allergies which are not manifested? except in sleep problems, i guess, if this is what it is.<br><br>
she does have sensitivity to sugar, and she is almost completely off white sugar, but still has a bit of honey or maple syrop, which our tibetan healer said was okay, but we moved, so we can't see him now. the only white sugar she gets if she gets a cookie or a muffin when she is out, about once a week or less.<br><br>
actually, as i think about it, it can't be related to sugar. i always get irritated at dh when she has a muffin with him and then sleeps badly, but as i think about it, when we were visiting a friend for a week, she ate the most sugar in her life (not much, by any standards, some barely sweet cookies etc), and she slept so well.<br><br>
gosh, i knew what was causing this. thanks for your support.
 

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Np. Sorry I'm not more help. My munchkin's allergy list is longer than my grocery list, so that's always my first thought, but, not always what a problem turns out to be. Mostly I wanted you to know that you're not alone.<br><br>
I hope someone has better info or advice for you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>infraread</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7986709"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Mostly I wanted you to know that you're not alone.<br><br>
.</div>
</td>
</tr></table></div>
<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"><br>
much appreciated. it does help to know that others are going through the same thing.
 

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Allergies - maybe dairy? Try and take all cow/goat dairy from her for 6 weeks and see if there is a difference. Dairy takes 6 weeks to get out of the body.<br><br><br><br>
Or could it be related to a difficult birth in any way?
 

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My sister has night terrors. I did a ton of research:<br><br>
Keep her barefoot.<br>
Minimize the weight and puffiness of blankets and pillows.<br>
Minimize the amount of pillows and stuffed animals.<br>
Once it starts, if you apply a cool washcloth to her feet it could stop it.<br>
If you can get her to go to the bathroom during it, it could stop it.<br>
They are much more likely to happen when the child is stressed/overtired/overstimulated.<br>
They are much more likely to happen when the child has respiratory difficulty.<br><br>
There hasn't been much medical research on night terrors, because doctors say that it causes no harm -- it is just an inconvenience for the parents. Supposedly, the child doesn't remember it in the morning. (My sister seems to.) So, most of the ideas about how to stop or reduce them come from trial and error of parents.<br><br>
They tend to occur in the same children who have bed wetting and sleep walking.<br><br>
The theory about night terrors is that the child's brain has not yet developed the mechanism to wake him up properly if his breathing is obstructed, or that the child's brain mis-interprets the situation as obstructed breathing when it is really safe.<br><br>
It has also been found to usually happen at roughly the same amount of minutes after the child falls asleep. Many parents found that if they timed it a few times, then they could go and slightly disturb the sleep of the child a few minutes before it would have occurred, and that seems to prevent it from kicking in.<br><br>
------<br><br>
My sister's fear responses are quiet, so my parents never even realized the night terrors were happening. I shared a room with her and was almost 5 years older than her, so I knew something was happening. It wasn't until a few years ago that I read about night terrors and recognized it.
 

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I was going to post last night but my internet was down.<br><br>
Many sleep disturbances are worse when a child is overtired. They usually happen at the beginning of the night. If napping or an earlier bedtime are possible, it might help. This might be why they are worse when a child is sick or has asthma since they aren't sleeping as well. My ds has had a few night terrors when he has had congestion.<br><br>
OT but related, I recently read that there was a link between children who had tonsilectomies (for unrelated reasons) and a reduction of their ADHD. The theory was that they hadn't been getting quality sleep and after about a year of better sleep, some of them had their ADHD symptoms disappear.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Gitti</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7988774"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Allergies - maybe dairy? Try and take all cow/goat dairy from her for 6 weeks and see if there is a difference. Dairy takes 6 weeks to get out of the body.<br><br><br><br>
Or could it be related to a difficult birth in any way?</div>
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i doubt it is dairy, as then her terrors would not have cycled, right? what would be other signs of dairy sensitivity? she loves milk, so i don't want to traumatise her by elimination, if am not very certain it is dairy. the only thing that i might think of, her stools are always very soft. is this a sign? but it is not diarhea, and her stomach is not upset. thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Lady Lilya</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7990638"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;"><br>
My sister has night terrors. I did a ton of research:<br><br>
Keep her barefoot.<br>
Minimize the weight and puffiness of blankets and pillows.<br>
Minimize the amount of pillows and stuffed animals.<br>
Once it starts, if you apply a cool washcloth to her feet it could stop it.<br>
If you can get her to go to the bathroom during it, it could stop it.<br>
They are much more likely to happen when the child is stressed/overtired/overstimulated.<br>
They are much more likely to happen when the child has respiratory difficulty.<br><br>
There hasn't been much medical research on night terrors, because doctors say that it causes no harm -- it is just an inconvenience for the parents. Supposedly, the child doesn't remember it in the morning. (My sister seems to.) So, most of the ideas about how to stop or reduce them come from trial and error of parents.<br><br>
They tend to occur in the same children who have bed wetting and sleep walking.<br><br>
The theory about night terrors is that the child's brain has not yet developed the mechanism to wake him up properly if his breathing is obstructed, or that the child's brain mis-interprets the situation as obstructed breathing when it is really safe.<br><br>
It has also been found to usually happen at roughly the same amount of minutes after the child falls asleep. Many parents found that if they timed it a few times, then they could go and slightly disturb the sleep of the child a few minutes before it would have occurred, and that seems to prevent it from kicking in.<br><br>
------<br><br>
My sister's fear responses are quiet, so my parents never even realized the night terrors were happening. I shared a room with her and was almost 5 years older than her, so I knew something was happening. It wasn't until a few years ago that I read about night terrors and recognized it.</div>
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thank you Leigh. we are already doing most if not all things on the list: barefoot, no blankets, not toys in bed, i ask her if she needs to pee, and if she is responsive, this helps.<br><br>
the overtired / overstimulated -- sometimes it makes sense, sometimes it is the opposite. like when we were house guests for a week; or when her uncle was staying with us for a week, both times were very high on overstimulation, and she slept well. go figure.<br><br>
she won't nap. some days i feel she needs one, but she absolutely won't. even if i lie down with her. she might close her eyes, and then perk up and say, 'oh, when i close my eyes, i am falling asleep, so let's get up' <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lol"><br><br>
she is not bedwetting, hasn't since 2. not sleep walking.<br><br>
i will try to gently stir her before it starts, i think hers are about the same time after she falls asleep. though sometimes i am asleep with her! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lol"><br><br>
tonight she slept well. she went through this stage, i guess, but it was short and quiet, just a whimper once.<br><br>
also, her sleep has always been very light. as a baby until 2 she nursed 3-5 times a night. i nightweaned her partially when she was 27 months, and her sleep improved dramatically. it got worse again at about 34 months, when DS was 3 month old.<br><br>
now, when she is going through an episode, even if she is not screaming, my slightest movement causes her to start over again.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>4evermom</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7991132"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I was going to post last night but my internet was down.<br><br>
Many sleep disturbances are worse when a child is overtired. They usually happen at the beginning of the night. If napping or an earlier bedtime are possible, it might help. This might be why they are worse when a child is sick or has asthma since they aren't sleeping as well. My ds has had a few night terrors when he has had congestion.<br><br>
OT but related, I recently read that there was a link between children who had tonsilectomies (for unrelated reasons) and a reduction of their ADHD. The theory was that they hadn't been getting quality sleep and after about a year of better sleep, some of them had their ADHD symptoms disappear.</div>
</td>
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thanks. i do have a feeling she is overtired during some of them. but there are days, like yesterday, when she was super overtired, and she slept well. but we did have an earlier bedtime.<br><br>
dh is away on business, and when he is away, we always do an earlier bedtime. when he is home, it is impossible, as she wants to wait for him, and he comes home late.<br><br>
i wish she would nap. she won't. she resist it so much, even if she is literally falling asleep when she lies down next to me when i am nursing DS down for his nap. she'd say not to stroke her leg, as this would only make her fall asleep. i even tried nursing her down, she loves nursing, she used to fall asleep when nursing when she was younger. and she sometimes would even say she doesn't want to nurse, as it would make her sleepy. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/dizzy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Dizzy">:<br><br>
we had such a great night. i feel so rested. wow. haven't been so rested in weeks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
<div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">
<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Gitti</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/7988774"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;"><br><br>
Or could it be related to a difficult birth in any way?</div>
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we didn't have a traumatic birth, but she did witness me being hit by a car when she was 31 months, and then the whole lovely stuff afterwards -- ambulance, er, first separation, first night separation for 4 nights, dealing with my immobility and an array of home support workers who had to help me to take care of her, and then, to top it off, a baby brother. so she's been through a lot.<br><br>
i just wish i knew how to help her to sleep better. that's a one million dollar question.
 

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My 3.5 yo has them and they are very much related to overtiredness, too. Getting him in bed at 8 instead of 9 can make all the difference. Waking him up (a bit) after he's been sleeping for about 1.5 hrs seems to work too.
 

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bumping. Good stuff.<br><br>
~Tracy
 

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Ack, I think my 2 y/o has night terrors. She wakes every hour from when she crashes (after an extended bedtime routine of flipping all over the place) till we finally bring her to bed aroudn midnight. Then she wakes for like an hour in the midle of hte night to mes with my hair or tell me to move over (I am at teh EDGE of the bed, kid!).<br><br>
She does sleep beter when she is sleeping better, did that make sense? If we somehow break the cycle, seh will sleep better, but we just had daylight savings time and it set things back big time, again. I can't deal wit hthis till she is 5 y/o! i need a cure.....
 

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It's funny (okay it's not). DS used to have night terrors. And he wouldn't remember them in the morning. He's also had food intolerances off and on (we keep thinking he outgrows them, but he just changes symptoms). Now that I'm reading this, I realize that his night terrors were when he was back on soy/milk, and he doesn't have them when he's off the milk/soy. Interesting. I hadn't seen that correlation before.
 
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