Thoughts on flouride??

Quote:
Our water does not have Toxic waste AKA flouride in it so we just have toxic toothpaste, he is 5 and NOT good at brushing his teeth at all, will hardly ever let me do it for him, and had never been to the dentist(he's way to scared to go) His teeth look great I always look for cavities and have never seen any. My DH belives that dentists are evil and create work for themselves, for example the stick that pick thing into our teeth, DH thinks they do this to open up our teeth abit so a cavity can form. Sounds crazy but I belive him, I use to go to the dentist all the time and brush my teeth all the time(still do). And he hardly ever went to the dentist when he was younger, and I know he don't brush as much as I do. I have way more filling than he does he has 1 I have 1 on the bottom and all my mollars on the top. So go figure maybe he has a point, he also thinks that toothpaste(maybe the toxic waste part of it)does damage to our teeth. That could be true to.

Quote:
But kids who use fluoride have more cavities at the base of the teeth.

And will see a weakening of their bones by the time they are 40.

http://www.fluoridealert.org/

Fluoride is very nasty stuff and should never be allowed to be in our water. It is outlawed in Europe.

I raised three kids on well water - no fluoride in toothpaste, nor at the dentist, and none had cavities until they went to college.

I believe it depends more on whether the child drinks a lot of juice and eats sweets or not. Juice is the main culprit for young children.

Our kids drank only water as do our grandchildren and there are no cavities in their teeth either. Now you can't say that it is in their genes, because I had lots of cavities, but I had lots of sugar in my childhood. Dh had some cavities.

Quote:
I'm sure there are some unscrupulous dentists out there, but there are good ones too. I've gone to the dentist every six months for the last 26 years, and I've never had a cavity, or any other dental issues that required any extra dental work. Dh also goes to the dentist every 6 months, but he gets cavities all the time. That mostly has to do with the acidity of a person's saliva, and "soft" enamal on the teeth. I believe both of those things are genetic.

Quote:
Interesting. I've not had great nutrition throughout my life. I've been a sugar addict for most of my life. I've drank more soda than most people have. There is no explanation for the condition of my teeth other than luck, or genetics. Since neither my mom, her brother, her sister, or my sister have ever had a cavity, it's hard for me to believe that genetics has absolutely nothing to do with it. Plus, none of my first cousins on my mom's side have ever had a cavity. My dad has had lots and lots of cavities. All of our diets are very similar, except that my sister, dad and I have major sweet tooths! We have consumed lots of sugar over our lifetimes. That said, my mom probably had much better nutrition during pregnancy than dh's mom did. Who knows? I'm sure you've done much more research than I have. I'm just going by my personal experience here.

It's hard for me to believe that genetics don't play a role, at least in some cases. My kids are twins, so they had the same womb environment, and they eat all the same foods, drink only water, have very little sugar intake (they actually don't seem to like it much--didn't touch their birthday cakes), get their teeth brushed by us twice a day, and one of them has a ton of cavities while the other has none. The only explanation that makes sense to me is that they just have genetically different teeth and that cavity-twin's teeth are weaker in some way. It is a frustrating explanation in that it doesn't leave room for me to do much in the way of preventing more cavities. For now, I am just removing dried fruit from their diet (they didn't really eat much of it anyway, just occassional raisins at friends' houses), and trying to brush their teeth three times a day. We will stay flouride-free.

Lex

Lex,

Your boys' situation is very interesting to me. I wonder what other WAPF mamas like Toraji would say. My only other thought would be how well the twin with cavities is absorbing his nutrients (any digestive issues? eats more soy?)

Congratulations on the new baby!!

Susan,

My understanding is that it's not only dietary habits while you're an adult but the amount of nutrients that your mother consumed (minerals in addition to vitamin A and D) while you were in the womb and forming your teeth.

If anyone is interested in reading more about nutrition and teeth formation and health, Weston Price's book, "Nutrition and Physical Degeneration" is the one to read.

http://www.westonaprice.org/traditio...ry_wisdom.html

re: fluoride
I am totally opposed to internal fluoride consumption. I don't think it should exist in our water supply, and that it just does bad things to the body.

However, I am convinced of topical fluoride's effects as it was the tipping point that completely killed my DD's decay. You can read my story and fluoride suggestions on this thread here: http://mothering.com/discussions/sho...d.php?t=419877

Lex-
Is it Lukas that has the decay? Or Jasper? Do they have different eating patterns, like does one eat more veggies than the other, or do they both prefer the same things? Does one have any health issues that the other does not (allergies, eczema, etc)? While they both did have the same womb environment, certain genetic components can indeed play a part, like celiac or allergies which can cause one twin to have problems absorbing nutrients over the other. Also, I've heard anectdotal reports of one twin taking more than their fair share of nutrients over the other in the womb, making one "stronger" in their life force (chi) than the other after they are born. Since they are fraternal then they'd be working with a different egg/sperm combo which could also play a part.

Also, I've heard that fevers during pregnancy and in the infant anywhere between 4-9 months are correlated with tooth decay, as well as antibiotic use during pregnancy and premature birth. But you'd think anything during pregnancy or birth would affect both twins, not just one.

This is all just guesswork on my part, but could possibly give you some ideas...

Quote:
It's Jasper who has the decay. In thinking about this more, I did point out to myself (and dw) that even though the boys shared my womb, Lukas was born a whole lot bigger than Jasper. They were born two weeks early, and Lukas weighed 8 lbs, 7 oz, and Jasper weighed 6 lbs. 4 oz. Everyone said that Jaz was still a great sized baby for being a twin, and two weeks early, but I always wondered if his placenta wasn't quite as fabulous as the one Lukas got. They are about the same size now, so I don't think the size difference at birth was a genetic difference (that's what everyone said for awhile). Jasper is also more prone to diarrhea now, whereas Lukas always has perfect poops. But it's Lukas who has all the allergies and sensitive skin. I think they really eat the same foods (although Lukas is cow dairy free, he eats goat products instead. . . Jasper eats very little cow dairy, but does have some), if anything Jasper eats more green foods (he takes a chlorella supplement that Lukas refuses). So, I'm thinking that maybe it was something in the womb, some discrepency between their placentas that caused his teeth to not be as strong.

I think we'll wait until the boys are really able to not swallow their toothpaste at all, and then we may try some topical flouride to see if that helps.

Thanks for all the great insight!!

Lex

Quote:
My DS doesn't have decay but he does have digestive issues and tends to collect tartar/calculus right now. He is prone to diarrhea and he has been dropping in the height charts rapidly since being weaned...as his gut went downhill too. All this means his mineral transport/absorption is impaired. So I would suggest that Jasper's gut could be an issue. Chronic diarrhea is indicative of digestive problems... the peds all say it's normal, they've said that to me too, but my son has the stool bacterial tests to show that it's not.

I'd up Jasper's minerals in addition to the A&D, especially if he doesn't eat much cow dairy. The only other source of calcium rather than milk products that I would trust to be absorbed and utilized by a young child, especially with digestive issues, would be homemade bone broths. The calcium in their diets definately effects the teeth and greens and other sources of calcium just isn't enough or well digested to really make a difference.

My guy can only do goat yogurt right now, and I've finally got him consistently on a raw grassfed source.