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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was talking to SIL on the phone the other day and said something regarding informed consent and circ (tangental to the topic, btw).<br><br>
She said something like, "Yeah, they should inform parents that if you don't get your son circd but his brothers are he grows up all sensitive and messed up about it."<br><br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/jaw.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="dropjaw"><br><br>
As long as I have known BIL (since he was 11, btw) he has been *really* outwardly into his intactness.<br><br>
She said that they have sexual issues BECAUSE of his foreskin (lubrication, the forskin "snags" so they have to reposition a lot, etc...) and that they will DEFINATELY circ any boys of their's.<br><br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/jaw.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="dropjaw"><br><br>
What can I say?<br><br>
1) It sounds like they are having some sexual incompatiblity issues I don't know how to address (I thought it was considered to be the *oposite* for intact men--- better lube, not so painful for the woman, etc...).<br><br>
2) Most of the boys on my side of the family are circd. I was hoping it wouldn't be true on DP's side and would like to educate them before they have kids.<br><br>
Thanks for the input.
 

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It sounds like she has issues with circumcision (and, yes reading this post, I think sexual issues that may not be directly relating to circ, but she is attributing them, but maybe I am just reading into it). Does he really agree with her? I'd send them some facts on this issue.
 

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Dh's boss is intact and he's got a tight frenulum and says he wants to circ his son as well. I told dh to point out to him that complications from circumcision are 1 in 10, but his problem is fixable and pretty rare.
 

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I agree with the pp. Also on a personal note, I never climaxed before I was with my dh, who is intact. Maybe that has something to do with him being intact or just our compatability, but whatever it is, I'm not complaining.
 

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Wow; I have been intact for 57 years and never have I had any problems like this. Acutally it is right the opposite, more lube, no problems at all. Sounds like she is trying to put you down for trying to keep boys as God made them. Have you been on her case about circing a son or something. Sounds like she is trying to throw something in your face. I can tell you from first hand experience that lube has NEVER been a problem and what tags can she be talking about, he would have to be circed to have a tag unless he was retracted as a small boy and now has skin tags from it. Hang in there don't give up stand your ground, your are right and she knows it. Good luck!
 

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Why not go to your BIL and say "SIL told me that you guys are planning on circing if you have boys...is she serious?"<br><br>
People can say boneheaded things...my sister told me that they were circing their son (born one month before my first son) because they didn't want him to be different from his cousins (SIL and other sister had already circ'd their sons)...this was about 10 seconds after I told her that we would NOT be circing.<br><br>
And back to the OP...lets say his Dad even had trouble with his foreskin to the point that he really, honestly did need to be circ...in what world does that mean his son should have to have surgery? What if he needed a bypass or brain surgery? Are they going to have that done on their son too?<br><br>
Casey
 

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My ex comes from an intact family and his brother chose to circ in his late 20's due to sexual issues he had. I thought it was crazy myself having never had any sexual issues with intact men. My ex did not go into detail with me about it, guess he felt it was a privacy issue which is understandable, so I don't know exactly what it was.<br><br>
If it was me I'd explain to SIL that even if they do have issues that doesn't mean that their sons will.<br><br>
If they really think that circ would cure their problems (not saying it would) then why isn't her DH circed now? If he is still intact and they have no plans on circing dh himself then I'd question their motivations. I mean if they think it's the perfect cure why haven't they taken it?<br><br>
just to be clear I'm not supportive of circing at all, I just think that the standard pro intactness education won't be enough in this case to change their minds. Their reasoning and expereince behind their assumptions need to be addressed
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Intactguy57</strong></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Wow; I have been intact for 57 years and never have I had any problems like this. Acutally it is right the opposite, more lube, no problems at all. Sounds like she is trying to put you down for trying to keep boys as God made them. Have you been on her case about circing a son or something. Sounds like she is trying to throw something in your face. I can tell you from first hand experience that lube has NEVER been a problem and what tags can she be talking about, he would have to be circed to have a tag unless he was retracted as a small boy and now has skin tags from it. Hang in there don't give up stand your ground, your are right and she knows it. Good luck!</div>
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No, she definately wasn't throwing this in my face. She sounded pretty upset that it has bothered BIL his whole life. I wouldn't be surprised if he was retracted as a young boy--- his dad & both brothers are circ'd so they probably didn't know a lot about care for it.<br><br>
Oh, and she would NEVER directly insult my parenting, lol. Just wouldn't go there. I know she thinks I'm freaky (liberal in WA vs conservative in TX) but since I am 7 years older and have two kids (verus her zero) she just wouldn't go there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>morning glory</strong></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Why not go to your BIL and say "SIL told me that you guys are planning on circing if you have boys...is she serious?"</div>
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I definatley plan on discussing this with BIL. Right now he is in Iraq, though (shipped out in December, should see him in June and then not again until Dec or later) so I thought I would try to get some info together before I talked to him next.<br><br>
I also felt really bad for both of them. It sounds like it has caused a lot of pain/self-esteem issues for him and that they are having some sexual issues that could use a bit of help too.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Arduinna</strong></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">If they really think that circ would cure their problems (not saying it would) then why isn't her DH circed now? If he is still intact and they have no plans on circing dh himself then I'd question their motivations. I mean if they think it's the perfect cure why haven't they taken it?</div>
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I'm actually going to bring that up as an issue w/BIL, but I want to have some facts behind it (you know, like, "You could get circd as an adult, but just so you know the evidence says it will not help w/the lube issue" and actually give some research to them). I am also going to point out that I think it is probably jealousy on the part of his brothers since I know my other BIL considers himself to have a small penis and that DP would probably prefer to be intact himself. They are also brothers and tease about EVERYTHING, I didn't realize he might actually be holding on to angst about something like this, kwim?<br><br>
They aren't chronologically young, but they are both fairly young and are still really finding themselves as individuals and as a couple. If I can help them, I would want to.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thanks for the input so far.<br><br>
I guess I would like some info (links, resources if possible) addressing the folloiwng things:<br><br>
1) Lube issues in circd vs intact men w/female partners<br>
2) "sexual experience" issue in circd vs intact men w/female partners<br><br>
There's not a "how to deal with a foreskin" for adults manual, is there?<br><br>
I know this is off the intended purpose of the board, but I really feel like if I can get them to like/accept/be comfortable with BIL's foreskin they will be less likely to cut their own son.<br><br>
TIA
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I'm so glad at this point that I have 12K posts. If this was my 1st post I'm sure I would have been reported by this point! I am NOT obsessed w/BIL's penis, I *swear* <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lol">
 

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why hasn't bil (as an adult) gone in for the cir? if they think that cir would cure all of that then why haven't they done it.<br>
I defintely think that if they insist on doing it to their children, then bil should go first.<br>
If he's too scared to do it,then he shouldn't be allowed to cir his sons...<br><br><br><br>
(i don't think he should be allowed anyways, but legally he is)
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Jen,<br><br>
Thanks so much. I can *hope* that will help <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/thumb.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="thumbs up">
 

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I think we need to realize that some adult guys just don't like their foreskins. From what i have read the benefit's of circumcision that we tout here aren't enjoyed by all. For every one account I hear about the rolling action of the foreskin I here another about the foreskin getting in the way.<br><br>
Trivializing these intact mens complaints seems to be really mean to them and their partners. Cutting their sons isn't the right response and there has to be a way to get this across without patronizing them by saying they need a user's manual for their dick.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Minky</strong></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I think we need to realize that some adult guys just don't like their foreskins. From what i have read the benefit's of circumcision that we tout here aren't enjoyed by all. For every one account I hear about the rolling action of the foreskin I here another about the foreskin getting in the way.</div>
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I really think that this only happens in America, for the most part. My dh is British, and no one over here even thinks about the foreskin being a problem.<br><br>
Whether the male in question is an infant or a teenager or an adult.<br><br>
It's interesting, isn't it? All of the questions this board gets from moms worried about their child's foreskin. You just don't see that in the rest of the world. I really think it has to do with the cultures, and not the foreskins themselves!<br><br>
In America, the foreskin is seen as both expendable and as a potential problem - so parents (and intact adult men themselves) are looking for problems - and if they find something wrong 'down there' they are likely to blame it on the foreskin because they've been taught that having a foreskin is problematic.<br><br>
Whereas in the UK, the foreskin is just part of a man's body - no one expects problems with it, anymore than one expects problems with a girl's labia. So we don't tend to either see or create 'problems' with the foreskin.<br><br>
I'm guessing that this is what is going on with the intact men in the States who have a 'problem' with their foreskin. If they lived in a culture where everyone was intact (rather than one in which they are the minority), then it would be easier to find the actual problem, rather than blaming everything on the foreskin, you know?
 

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Just to add - I know that there are some genuine foreskin problems - most that can be remedied with simple stretching exercises. I dont' mean to minimise those at all.<br><br>
But I just think that most of the 'problems' with foreskins in American society are caused by society's message to intact men that there is something wrong with them. As in the 'fox's tail' analogy.
 

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ok maybe I missed these points before? But if BIL was teased by FIL and brothers then this may be part of the issue, not really sure how to address it though. And ITA with PPs that mentioned the lubrication issue should be looked at from all angles, which means maybe they aren't having enough foreplay? Maybe there is a hormonal reason that is causing her to have low lubrication? Have they tried lube?<br><br>
I do think this board tends to promote the idea that all intact penis's are problem free and all circed ones are full of issues and problems. I've seen lots of stuff posted here over the years that makes assumptions about the success of sex soley based on intact status. And I agree with the PP that we do a disservice to perpetuate that thinking.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Minky</strong></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Trivializing these intact mens complaints seems to be really mean to them and their partners. Cutting their sons isn't the right response and there has to be a way to get this across without patronizing them by saying they need a user's manual for their dick.</div>
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I am not trying to trivalize their complaints OR patronize them.<br><br>
1) I would prefer they left any sons intact<br>
2) I would prefer they had a long and happy sex life. SIL sounds like sex is currently painful and anxiety causing for them both.<br><br>
If I can help with either, I would like to.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Arduinna</strong></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">ok maybe I missed these points before? But if BIL was teased by FIL and brothers then this may be part of the issue, not really sure how to address it though.</div>
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I assume he was teased by his brothers, I can virtually guarantee he was not teased by his father. Of course, he was also teased about 1000000000 other things (as DP was) that don't seem to have scarred him.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">And ITA with PPs that mentioned the lubrication issue should be looked at from all angles, which means maybe they aren't having enough foreplay? Maybe there is a hormonal reason that is causing her to have low lubrication? Have they tried lube?</td>
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I'm going to bring these ideas up.<br><br><div style="margin:20px;margin-top:5px;">
<div class="smallfont" style="margin-bottom:2px;">Quote:</div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="99%"><tr><td class="alt2" style="border:1px inset;">I do think this board tends to promote the idea that all intact penis's are problem free and all circed ones are full of issues and problems. I've seen lots of stuff posted here over the years that makes assumptions about the success of sex soley based on intact status. And I agree with the PP that we do a disservice to perpetuate that thinking.</td>
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Good point. I guess I was just surprised by the specific issue (lube) that I had never heard of being an issue BECAUSE of a foreskin (though, of course, it could be an issue for someone w/a foreskin).<br><br>
Thanks!
 
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