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I think it is a combination of things. One is in Canada they have there public health system that has stopped paying for circ. Here we have probably thousands of different health care plans and only a small fraction no longer pay for circ.

Another is cultural brain washing. We as a nation has been taught so long about the evils of the foreskin that we cant get past it.

Yet another is that no one even gives circ a second thought it is just what is done when a boy is born. They just dont think farther than that.
 

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I think that the medical community in the U.S. is so use to maintaining the status quo, that anything that is contrary to it is shunned. It is the same with complimentary medicine (holistic), most allopathic doctors won't even consider it unless the patient brings it up. Unfortunately pill pushing is taking over the art of medicine. So the same with circumcision, it is what is taught in med school so doc's continue to believe its the right thing to do.
 

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Three factors that I can see:

1. We have a private medical system that encourages greed over ethics, curing disease, patient satisfaction, etc.

2. For most American families, there are at least two generations of brutalized men who are ego-bound to defend their doctor-mutilated penises. We also have mothers who cannot and will not believe they ever consented to harm for their children. For both groups, it causes them to demand the procedure for the next generation.

3. Our population also has a general sense of superiority in all things - the idea that the United States is the absolute best. The thought process is this: "Circumcision is a thing that we do in America, therefore circumcision is best and if other nations aren't doing it, that is because they are behind." Kind of ironic, isn't it?

The bottom line is that doctors started this mess and they're going to have to get us out. It will take the AAP, the AMA, or whoever to come out and say that, "Circumcision is bad, circumcision is unnecessary. We're sorry." before we can really see an end to non-religious circumcision in this country. But because many doctors are greedy, mutilated, mutilators, and ethnocentric, this is a slow road.
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikki98 View Post
I think that the medical community in the U.S. is so use to maintaining the status quo, that anything that is contrary to it is shunned.
While I agree with this, and the obsession the US has with perceived cleanliness (pretty soon they'll be selling hand soap made almost entirely of bleach
), I have to say I am becoming more and more convinced that $$ is at the heart of it. After a couple articles here and there that were popping up about human foreskin being used in dermatology testing and biogenetics industries, I've been kinda gung ho about searching for some real, unbiased information about this (nothing from anything remotely anti-circ...I'm looking for abstracts and the like). It is truly remarkable how big an industry this is - I had no idea. The more I read, the clearer it all becomes.

Also, if it becomes status-quo that non-religious circumcision is harmful and unnecessary, people that support religious circumcision get up in arms that it's somehow speaking out against their religion. You see it happen even here, in this forum. If someone says they are against circumcision in ALL regards, they are accused of being anti-religion. *shrug* (and I'll probably get in trouble for saying even this, which will prove my point).
Since society at large in this country will never speak up against ritual religious circumcision as being barbaric, how can it seem that bad when speaking in non-religious terms? Making a concession - ANY CONCESSION *at all* makes it seem like it's probably not that bad after all.
 

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Quote:
Making a concession - ANY CONCESSION *at all* makes it seem like it's probably not that bad after all.
:
 

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Lets not forget once the insurance don't pay for the circumcision Doctors offer it in their office in a more less chance of being with local so docs will still get a profit and proably even more of a profit when they 'lower the budget standard' .

Depends on per reason = why ?

I shall also say so much 'fear' of being invidual they are feared that if they go away from 'conformity' that they will 'be lost for good'.

Issues with Images- look at how many ppl go bullimic or anorexic - get boob implants, maybe some men think circ'ed as the 'pretty boy' because the 'doctor' did it , if you go 'different ' than what is assumed 'normal' you are called a 'freak.
 

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Hmmm...well, we voted Bush into office twice....so what does that say?
(not trying to start a political discussion here! this is just the first thing that popped in my head!)
No seriously, the pp's are totally right on.
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by SammyJr View Post
Three factors that I can see:

1. We have a private medical system that encourages greed over ethics, curing disease, patient satisfaction, etc.

2. For most American families, there are at least two generations of brutalized men who are ego-bound to defend their doctor-mutilated penises. We also have mothers who cannot and will not believe they ever consented to harm for their children. For both groups, it causes them to demand the procedure for the next generation.

3. Our population also has a general sense of superiority in all things - the idea that the United States is the absolute best. The thought process is this: "Circumcision is a thing that we do in America, therefore circumcision is best and if other nations aren't doing it, that is because they are behind." Kind of ironic, isn't it?

The bottom line is that doctors started this mess and they're going to have to get us out. It will take the AAP, the AMA, or whoever to come out and say that, "Circumcision is bad, circumcision is unnecessary. We're sorry." before we can really see an end to non-religious circumcision in this country. But because many doctors are greedy, mutilated, mutilators, and ethnocentric, this is a slow road.

 

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But.

If American medical community came out tomorrow and said; "ups, circumcision bad - sorry dudes...."

What would happen?

How many million lawsuits there would be?

Nope. They will never say that aloud.

Besides where would researchers then harvest foreskins?
 

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I'm up here in Canada but, as an activist, there's really no border for me. Canadians watch 90% U.S. television, visit U.S. websites and are very influenced by the U.S. generally. The differences between the two countries that have probably led to Canada having a much lower rate right now are
(1)that we have become very
used to the public medical funding and, altho Canadians will lay out $1,000 for their dog or cat at a vet's office, they hate like hell to spend one extra nickel on human medical care. This year, we got 100% of the provinces and the federal civil service plan to cut medical funding of circ. That takes away any illusion that it could have a health benefit AND it makes it expensive for new parents to go out and get it.

(2) we are more of a nation of whistle blowers on the subject of circumcision damage than Americans have been in the past. Doctors absolutely hate it when the curtain of secrecy is pulled away from mistakes around this procedure. We've had a much publicized baby death in Penticton, BC in 2002 (Ryleigh McWillis, may he RIP) AND a hospital mix up of boys in Winnipeg, Manitoba in 2006. These cases came to light because someone in the hospital who was outraged called the press anonymously and blew the whistle. Once you get this happening in the U.S., and it is a natural result of all the activism, you'll see the tide change really fast. The Colleges of Physicians and Surgeons of Saskatchewan and B.C. have sent messages out to their members warning them of possible future lawsuits and the rising consumer movement.

(3) the rate never got as high in Canada as it did in the U.S. in the past century. I'm not sure of the numbers but I think the worst it ever got here was around 56%. This means that we never got so acculturated to seeing naked glanses (sp?) Maybe because we live in a cold climate, the foreskin was preserved on more males for warmth. We also have a great deal of British influence in Canada, being a member of the British Commonwealth of Nations, and the Brits really did some good research on keeping the intact penis back in the 1940s. . . the British never really got into it the way us N. Americans did.

That's my take on the differences. I have complete confidence that the time is approaching when we're going to see a miraculous end to circumcision in the U.S. I predict that what you'll see is the U. S. physician "discovering" the benefits of the intact penis and then enrolling the entire world in how brilliant they are . . . . much like they did with breastfeeding and women's intact perineums (sp?). Whatever it takes! I don't care if they get the credit as long as they stop it.

Baybee
 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by kimkabob5 View Post
In Canada, circumcision is becoming obsolete. Why isn't this happening here in the US as well?
Actually, I think it IS happening here, but just more slowly than in the rest of the English-speaking world. When my sons were born, in 1979 and 1987, the circumcision rate in the U.S. was 90%. Now it's around 55%. That's a substantial drop! Yes, it's still way too high, but we "have" made progress. There's hope for us yet!
(Quote marks are for emphasis. My computer won't let me underline.)
 

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What Kia said is totally true....even though the AAP says they dont recommend it, they also say that there are potential benefits and that ultimately its the parents choice. I dont think any other medical organizations have flat out said its wrong either. So anyone thinking about it or anyone who has already decided to do it will see this and say, oh, well, it is my choice afterall and there might be some sort of benefit so....and this isnt about to change any time soon. Maybe once we have social healthcare like other countries, our government will decide to stop paying for it and that will help. The fact that so many states still have medicaid funding for it is just plain sad.
 

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I dont think any other medical organizations have flat out said its wrong either.
In the English speaking speaking countries, if they did this would expose their members to lawsuits and possibly criminal charges.

I think its possible quite a few non-English speaking medical organizations have flat out said its wrong.
 

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Originally Posted by kxsiven View Post
But.

If American medical community came out tomorrow and said; "ups, circumcision bad - sorry dudes...."

What would happen?

How many million lawsuits there would be?

Nope. They will never say that aloud.

You're right, this would be a huge problem. If a group of ethical doctors were to want to end circumcision and officially discourage it, they would have to get quietly passed legislation banning lawsuits for circumcisions performed previous to a set date. And honestly, it would be worth it because the net result would be an almost overnight reduction of American circumcision rates into the single digits.

But that would mean finding a large enough group of enlightened, well connected doctors... difficult.
 
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