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<span style="font-family:'Comic Sans MS';"><span>I am not really looking for an answer.... just need to vent. I take Zander to the city forest several mornings through the week before work to run. He is off lead until we see another dog, and then I call him back, reward him with a treat and leash him. We walk past the other dog(s), he is praised, rewarded and then allowed off leash again. I have to do this as he sometimes has "issues" with other dogs.<br><br>
So today I meet two women who I talked with in the parking lot a week ago and told them about his "issues". So I see them and proceed to call Zander back to me and leash him up. They yell ahead and say "oh, it's the Borzoi" so I know they remember him. And then their three freaking dogs come running up to him!!!<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/irked.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="irked">: So I am trying like hell to hold him as an adult German Shepherd, an adult Golden Retriever and a Golden Retriever puppy jump at him. He did not make contact with any of the dogs but of course, he scared the crap out of the puppy, which I feel bad about. The two older dogs just continued to get at him as I tried to hold him. The two women just looked at me in shock. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/Cuss.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="cuss"><br><br>
Why are people like this!!! I do my part by controlling him and others let their dogs just come up to him and he's the 'bad' dog for reacting!!!<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/banghead.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="banghead"></span></span>
 

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I hear you.<br><br>
I hike in a little used park. It seems like some of the people I encounter there are either there b/c it's unlikely they'll have a social encounter, or they get so tripped out on the solitude that they can't react appropriately when they do see someone. Or maybe they notice the lack of people and dogs and assume anarchy is ok <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/shrug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="shrug"><br><br>
I haven't had a bad run-in in a while, so I can be philosophical about it. Come spring the entitled idiots will be out with their ill mannered puppies....
 

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That's so ridiculous. That would be like someone telling me that their dog has trouble with kids, and me letting my kids run up and pet him. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/eyesroll.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="roll"><br><br>
You would think that they would be more careful with their dogs' welfare?
 

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Yeah, I tell people that my little dog is fearful (doesn't bite, but cowers and hides behind me) around overly friendly dogs and people and they think it's an invitation to approach her. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/eyesroll.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="roll"> She's never bit before, but I had in incident last week where a group of children (unsupervised, between the ages of about 7 and 12) approached us and started petting my other dog (which is no problem, she's so friendly), but I told them to leave my little one alone because she gets scared easily. The little brats surrounded me and they started petting her, so I picked her up and they kept doing it. She started growling at them and they still tried to pet her! So I yelled at them and then their parents heard and came and acted like it was my fault for having a mean dog yell at their precious little angels. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/eyesroll.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="roll"><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/angry.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="angry">
 

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This is a good time for a PSA: Dogs jumping on another (strange) dog is NOT being friendly. If you have a dog who likes to jump up at other dogs, your dog is actually the one at fault and if he gets bitten you should not be surprised. Zander's reaction is very typical of sighthounds and other breeds who put a lot of stock in polite behavior; Zander doesn't have "dog issues" as much as "people issues," as in 90% of people who own dogs don't make them be polite.<br><br>
Our VERY wise trainer used to bring her Shelties to every puppy playgroup--puppy would jump up at Sheltie, she would slash the puppy, puppy would screech, and the trainer would say "Good mean teeth, Heidi! Hey, Bibi's owner--did you see how Heidi is teaching Bibi to be polite? Such good mean teeth, Heidi!" It was a fantastic way to a) teach puppies to get the heck out of adult dogs' faces, before they became adult dogs and wouldn't be given any slack by other dogs, and b) establish that "mean teeth" is the way that normal, polite, dog-appropriate dogs teach stupid rude dogs to behave themselves.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>thekimballs</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/10329403"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">This is a good time for a PSA: Dogs jumping on another (strange) dog is NOT being friendly. If you have a dog who likes to jump up at other dogs, your dog is actually the one at fault and if he gets bitten you should not be surprised. Zander's reaction is very typical of sighthounds and other breeds who put a lot of stock in polite behavior; Zander doesn't have "dog issues" as much as "people issues," as in 90% of people who own dogs don't make them be polite.<br></div>
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<br><span style="font-family:'Comic Sans MS';"><span>Once again, thank you Joanna. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug"><br><br>
I just keep waiting for the city to send me a letter saying that I cannot take Zander to the city forest anymore. Not sure if they can do this (and obviously they would have a fight on their hands) but I am doing all I can do to control his actions when we are there but let's face it, I cannot pick him up and carry him when other dogs approach..... jees, he is taller than me when standing on his hind feet! <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/lol.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="lol"> There are several dogs (some Labs, Jack Russells, a Weineramer (sp?) and a German Short-haired Pointer) that he absolutely LOVES to play with and they run the hell out of one another. I love to see him have fun like this.<br><br>
So I guess I will continue to do what I do and deal with stupid people when necessary.</span></span>
 

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I used to work for a Doggy Daycare who would take their dogs on outdoor excursions to the woods, let them off leash, and just let them run wild in the bush for a few hours. Between 2 people we often had 12-15 dogs. Problem was, other people often walked their dogs there, and how many people would like to see a pack of 12 dogs come charging at their dog? Not many. It caused a lot of problems in the area with local dog owners, and my boss basically told everyone that if they didn't want their dogs to get attacked, to not walk there during the times we would be there. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/eyesroll.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="roll"> Nice. Two dogs ended up with severe enough bites to need vet attention while I worked there. I quite for a whole host of other reasons as well (her stealing raw food from clients to feed her dog, was another hot button issue), but that was biggest one. Don't ask how we got them all to the woods (*cough* them throw them in the back of an astro van and drive like hell before the Old English Sheepdog tried to sit in your lap *cough*).
 

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Part of the problem is that most people who let their dogs run shouldn't... which, IMO, means that in public spaces no one should. No offense, but I have been rushed and nearly attacked my so many off-leash dogs. It doesn't sound like you are one of those problem people, for the record... but those idiots look at you and say "she is letting her dog off-leash, why shouldn't I?" Obviously they shouldn't because THEIR DOG IS NOT UNDER CONTROL, but they are UAVs and so then you have those badly behaved dogs doing things like running up to your dog and running up to me and my dog (who is dog shy and always gets bullied by other dogs, so I step in to protect him and wind up pissing people off).<br><br>
Anyways I just think that unless you're in a space designated for off-leash play, and even if you are, actually... you have to expect this. It sucks, I totally agree.<br><br>
I was rushed in the woods once by TWO PIT BULLS who charged us growling and barking and the owner DID NOT UNDERSTAND why I got so upset. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/irked.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="irked">:
 

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Just chiming in with a btdt <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/hug.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="hug">, LOVING Joanna's post (as usual), and wondering how it's possible to live with a dog and not realize they are not 1) human children and 2) animated furry TOYS?!?!?!<br><br>
My neighbors think I'm weird because I don't let my dogs run unleashed on our cul-de-sac like they do. When my dogs get out by accident and get annoyed with the other dogs rushing up to them and jumping on them, they ask me "why can't you socialize your dogs?" When I call my dogs back and put them away, they shake their heads and tell each other I'm just making "the problem" worse by isolating them. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/eyesroll.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="roll"><br><br>
One of my neighbor's dogs is a LARGE chocolate lab (as in large for his breed) who isn't hyper or obviously aggressive, but I have more than occasionally seen his tail stiffen and the hair on his back stand up around children playing on our street. It's a miracle there hasn't been an "incident", though his people swear he's nothing but a big, lazy teddy bear.<br><br>
PSA: NO DOG IS A TEDDY BEAR. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/angry.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="angry">
 

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Dear idiot people,<br>
In addition to the previously mentioned offenses, if you are a stranger and see me out in our yard with our dogs it is not a bright idea to just come into the yard uninvited, approach us rapidly and then act like my dog is a vicious monster who should be put to sleep for growling at you.
 

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Yeah, the majority of people/dog owners NEVER cease to amaze me <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/greensad.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="greensad"> Every weekend we take Miles to run with us on some hiking trails near our house. Typically there is quite low use when we're there (6:45am), but there are definitely other folks who use the trails to "walk" their dogs, mtn. bike, run, etc. There is no "leash law" on these trails and Miles does run off-lead with us, but he is very under control--runs at a heel on the main trail (wide jeep trail) and directly behind me on the narrow trails.<br><br>
There have been SEVERAL instances where other dogs just come flying up to us well out of sight of their "owners" and attempt to jump all over Miles. Miles is very polite, yet submissive at the same time. He does not tolerate rude behaviour, but unfortunately his response is to melt into a puddle on the ground in order to try to tell the other rude dogs that he's a helpless little puppy. I SO wish that he would stand up for himself, but that's not his thing. Between DH and I we are usually able to scare off the approaching dog, but sometimes there are more than one and we are left trying to get them away to "protect" Miles and wait for their irresponsible owners to catch up. However, they rarely do anything about it....saying "oh, they're friendly"...uh huh, yeah, whatever. That is NOT friendly behaviour, that is RUDE.<br><br>
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaanyway, case in point, we've been having issues with an older woman who runs with her two Vizlas. They are both rude and the one male (intact) has gone so far as to attempt to mount Miles (which was immediately abated by me shouting at the Vizla to get-the-f-off-my-dog). Of course, the woman took offense and said "Is your dog mean? Because he was attacked by a pitbull out here last week". I explained to her that no my dog isn't mean, but that her dog was being extremely rude and I'm not surprised that he got "attacked" (of course this whole time she is just standing there watching dumbfoundedly as I'm continuing to block her dogs' advances at Miles). She, obviously irked at my comment, ran off with her 2 dogs.<br><br>
Last weekend we saw her dogs again (of course she was lagging way behind and totally out of sight) and I took Miles off to the side of the trail while DH guarded. The intact male once again made an approach and DH advanced at it saying "NO". The dog skitted off for a second at which point idiot owner comes up behind saying once again "is your dog mean?". Oh boy, we have a winner <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/dizzy.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Dizzy">: DH says "Maam can you please control your dogs because this is the 3rd or 4th time that your dog has come at us and we don't appreciate it". Once again she stands there dumbfounded as her dog tries to come up behind Miles and mount up...I shout "go away" and he does. The woman replies that her dogs are friendly and that we don't need to kick her dog (uhm, we didn't <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/irked.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="irked"><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="smile">. She goes on to say something about her dogs being show dogs and that's why they're not neutered and that they're trained in many different areas including obedience....<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/blahblah.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="blah blah"> Right-o, that's why when you call your male to come he continues to sniff, pee on a bush, and go the opposite direction <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/eyesroll.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="roll"> She then yells at me to control MY DOG. Wow <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/angry.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="angry"><br><br>
To the OP, I feel your pain. It's not Zander's fault, he's doing what he should do. Just continue to be your dog's advocate and maybe somehow, someway, we'll get through to the rest of them!
 

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I'll add one:<br><br>
Dear idiotic (but, admittedly sweet) woman,<br><br>
Please do NOT approach from behind any woman who is standing at the back of her SUV about to lift her large elderly dog down to the ground so that we can enjoy a pleasant, non-hilly, non-icy walk downtown. Especially not at night. Especially not while it is so cold that said woman's ears are muffled by a hat. You are lucky that my dog stays tethered by a seatbelt in the back of my car, is basically friendly, and that I have good hearing. I turned and greeted you so that my dog knew everything was okeydokey about you before you went reaching into my car to pet him.<br><br>
Had you actually managed to sneak up on me and startle me as you reached into my car toward my dog I do believe you would have, at least, been soundly snarled and air-snapped at. And, I am just guessing that you then would have assumed that my dog is an aggressive monster.<br><br>
Luckily, all was well, my dog was happy to be petted by you and we all went away happy campers. But, please, don't assume reaching into stranger's car to pet a dog is a good idea. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/rolleyes.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="rolleyes"><br><br>
As an aside, this little lady really was very sweet said something along the lines of "I haven't had my dog therapy yet today". I'm glad we could provide. Just wait until we are away from the car and approach me from the front and ASK FIRST. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/Peace.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Peace">
 

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I feel you. I own pit bulls as a rule. I just dig that breed. I know it well and am damned good as a handler. One at a time, nowadays, however. I almost always have to lock him upstair to host playdates and playgroups. <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="/img/vbsmilies/smilies/eyesroll.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="roll"><br><br>
Or play human to dog shuffle as some go in and one goes out, or vice versa.<br><br>
Dear idiots:<br><br>
My dog might lick you to death. Back away from the tongue. Oh, he may want to sit on your foot and look at you longingly, wishing to be petted. Do not construe this as a stealth, matrix stylie subtle attack, or passive-aggressive gesture. It is honest and bold, like him. He might also bark at you, as he is very vocal and has found that barking is "talking". He likes to talk. He's a talker. Do not be put off by his barking. He's telling you to play w/him. He is not trying to ward you off. If his hair was standing up or his teeth were bared, then you should be worried. That waggin a mile a minute tail and goofy grin is just that-a really happy dog who wants to play.<br><br>
you dumbass!
 

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Dear parents,<br><br>
Please teach your children how to properly behave around dogs. Slowly walking towards a dog and then running screaming and giggling in the opposite direction makes them look an awful lot like a delicious, if wiley, prey item. <b><i>My</i></b> dog is not likely to mistake them for dinner, but I can't make guarantees about all the dogs in the world. Teach them how to properly interact with unknown dogs, and make sure they're supervised when meeting a new dog.<br><br>
Thanks,<br><br>
Me.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>onlyzombiecat</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/10330564"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Dear idiot people,<br>
In addition to the previously mentioned offenses, if you are a stranger and see me out in our yard with our dogs it is not a bright idea to just come into the yard uninvited, approach us rapidly and then act like my dog is a vicious monster who should be put to sleep for growling at you.</div>
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Amen!!! I had a neighbor come into our yard when Adelle and I were in it, not bothering anyone, and then when my little peke wanted to attack his dog (they came in HER yard)......he KICKED her!! I filed charges against him with the police.
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Romana9+2</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/10339054"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">People often say, "Oh, don't worry, he's friendly!" to which I have to respond, "Well SHE isn't!! Please call off your dogs!"<br><br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/angry.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="angry"><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/angry.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="angry"><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/angry.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="angry"><br><br>
Not to mention, "friendly" usually means poorly-trained, poorly-mannered, and rude.</div>
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Yeah, what I wanted to say in response to the woman in my previous post asking if my dog is mean is...."no, but *I* am"!!
 

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Dear Idiot people,<br>
I know my dog is chocolate lab and that he has a happy grin on his face and looks like he is having a great time. I know that I have a 3 year old with me and that by the looks of the situation, he is great with children. However, please do not assume that because he is great with my child and with me that he will appreciate or enjoy having your little kids run up to him to lift up his ears, pet his tail, or yell commands at him. It makes him nervous. It makes me angry. If you ask nicely, I will tell you that yes your child can pet him if he pets nicely and gently and does not yell. But please, ASK FIRST!
 

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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>boricuaqueen327</strong> <a href="/community/forum/post/10340500"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/community/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Dear Idiot people,<br>
I know my dog is chocolate lab and that he has a happy grin on his face and looks like he is having a great time. I know that I have a 3 year old with me and that by the looks of the situation, he is great with children. However, please do not assume that because he is great with my child and with me that he will appreciate or enjoy having your little kids run up to him to lift up his ears, pet his tail, or yell commands at him. It makes him nervous. It makes me angry. If you ask nicely, I will tell you that yes your child can pet him if he pets nicely and gently and does not yell. But please, ASK FIRST!</div>
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I could have written that! Only the dog is a she and the child is 2 <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/wink1.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="wink1"><br><br>
Question for you all - I had a run-in with another dog owner last week. A friend and her toddler were walking with me, my toddler and my chocolate lab in a wooded, official off-leash area. We met another lab (powerful-looking (intact I think) male) and his owner, the other lab tried to get frisky with Daisy, which she has never tolerated (she is spayed), she growled and snapped at him and the other owner promptly put her dog on a leash and took him away. 5 or 10 minutes later as we were leaving the wooded area on a narrow trail, the same dog came charging up and again tried to get intimate with Daisy, with the same results. We heard the owner calling for her dog, tried to get the dog to leave Daisy alone and when that failed I tried to get my DD organized to stay with my friend while I grabbed the other lab to take it back to its owner. Before I could do that - actually just as I was grabbing the dog, who was *completely* ignoring its owner - the owner arrived at a run, grabbed the dog roughly by the collar and started yelling at him and hitting him. In front of two children!!!! I was appalled, and I yelled at her to stop doing that. She was obviously upset with the situation - I think she thought he was terrorizing the kids somehow, although he really hadn't even looked at the kids, he was all about Daisy. Anyway, she said "what am I supposed to do? He wasn't paying any attention to me!!!" I tried to tell her that hitting was obviously ineffective and setting a really, really poor example for the kids (the dog, FWIW, did not appear to notice that he was being hit) and she kept saying "what else can I do?" and my friend cut right to the chase, bless her, and chimed in with "Keep him on a leash!" She stomped off, dragging the dog behind her.<br><br>
My question is, what should I have done? I feel like I could have reacted better, but it was all a bit frenzied and weird. Throughout everything my dog just kept trying to keep the other lab away from her and away from me and my DD, which I thought was appropriate so I didn't try to restrain her at all.
 

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I am not afraid to say that there are some dogs, and some (very rare) situations, where something that discomforts the dog is actually faster, more effective, and kinder than nagging and nagging at the dog. However, if you're not a professional trainer or under the care of one, cuffing or striking is absolutely insane.<br><br>
That kind of repeated hitting, hitting for refusing to obey a command, etc. are totally and completely useless and going to ruin that dog.<br><br>
In a situation like the one you describe, I would be worried about escalating the situation by yelling. The dogs were already very tense and either one could decide that they needed to make a move to either settle down the screaming humans or protect them. I think I would have leashed my dog in tightly and taken off as fast as I could and still keep dogs and kids under control.
 
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