[Aquaduct]

I believe it is approximately 750 per 100,000 of population, or nearly 1% of the US total population!!!

These are frankly bizarre figures when you consider the next worst in the developed world is below 200. My country thinks it has a problem because we have 180 per 100,000, the fifth highest incarceration rate in the OECD.

So I was interested in your thoughts. Your country is very wealthy, doesn't have particularly high unemployment, and most of the population is literate. The other country I know of that has similar incarceration rates is Russia, which is far less wealthy, and has high unemployment and alcoholism rates, but does share some other characteristics with the USA.

But what are your thoughts? It seems to me that such a high incarceration rate must be creating a lot of misery, and hopelessness. Criminals are still human beings. But perhaps you feel crime is becoming less thanks to this punitive criminal justice system that imprisons so many for such a long time?

Is America a safe country?

 

[dingogirl]

dp

 

[dingogirl]

When I lived there, even though I'd sometimes venture into "bad" areas, I never feared for my safety.

Quote:

According to a U.S. Department of Justice report, rates for many types of serious crime are similar in the U.S. and UK, but between 1981 and 1996 they dropped here and rose there. Rates of burglary, assault, and car theft are now higher in Britain. Murder and rape are still vastly higher here, but the gap has narrowed. American law-and-order advocates will say: Of course! We put more of our bad guys in jail! Defenders of civil liberties, on the other hand, tend to see the get-tough approach as a way of putting the screws to minorities, whose chances of getting sent up the river--even for minor offenses like marijuana possession--are disproportionately high.

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/040206.html

 

[CrazyRED]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquaduct I believe it is approximately 750 per 100,000 of population, or nearly 1% of the US total population!!! These are frankly bizarre figures when you consider the next worst in the developed world is below 200. My country thinks it has a problem because we have 180 per 100,000, the fifth highest incarceration rate in the OECD. So I was interested in your thoughts. Your country is very wealthy, doesn't have particularly high unemployment, and most of the population is literate. The other country I know of that has similar incarceration rates is Russia, which is far less wealthy, and has high unemployment and alcoholism rates, but does share some other characteristics with the USA. But what are your thoughts? It seems to me that such a high incarceration rate must be creating a lot of misery, and hopelessness. Criminals are still human beings. But perhaps you feel crime is becoming less thanks to this punitive criminal justice system that imprisons so many for such a long time? Is America a safe country?

The way that you have asked this is too limited, IMO. This issue isn't as cut and dried. There are things that are illegal here that aren't in other countries. A few more factors need to be considered.

What are inmates incarcerated for?
Where did you get your numbers?
Do your numbers account for those incarcerated more than once?
Etc.

 

[Aquaduct]

I think the numbers are pretty official. They are based on the no. of prisoners locked up at any one time, divided by the population at the last census. It is not very hard maths to do.

Apparently the US has a prison population that is about 2.5 million or more, and rising. The total pop. is about 300 million.

For my country it is about 7000 and a bit for prisoners, and 4.14 million pop.

These figures are not in dispute. Of course they don't include what people are incarcerated for.

I just find it extraordinary that a country can have nearly 1% of it's pop. behind bars. France has about 66 per 100,000 in prison. And it is not a more violent, more thieving, more lawless country than the US. What is it doing right?

 

[CrazyRED]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquaduct I think the numbers are pretty official. They are based on the no. of prisoners locked up at any one time, divided by the population at the last census. It is not very hard maths to do. Apparently the US has a prison population that is about 2.5 million or more, and rising. The total pop. is about 300 million. For my country it is about 7000 and a bit for prisoners, and 4.14 million pop. These figures are not in dispute. Of course they don't include what people are incarcerated for. I just find it extraordinary that a country can have nearly 1% of it's pop. behind bars. France has about 66 per 100,000 in prison. And it is not a more violent, more thieving, more lawless country than the US. What is it doing right?

Source?

 

[angelpie545]

I think it's for many reasons. #1, as stated above the punishments don't fit the crime. #2 The war on drugs. Instead of treatment programs and help with schooling once an addict has recovered, we bar offenders from receiving financial aid from school institutions, don't offer free treatment programs with government assistance..usually. Sometimes there are exceptions to the rule. We lock people up for long periods of time as well. I think we could avoid a lot of this if we legalized marijuiana, the effects on the body of which are equal to alcohol and tabacco. Not one is worse than the other. I know plenty of responsible people who smoke pot regularly for medical and psychiatric reasons. #3 Our "pill for every ill" culture. This can and does sometimes result in over-medication and brain damage and can account for why some individuals commit crimes. #4 Not enough access to healthcare for those who really need it, and also not enough help for the poor. When you are poor and everyone including the government turns you away when you most need help some will turn to crime. #5. Early exposure to violent and sexual violence through the media. #6 Poor diet.

Hope that makes sense to you all..I'm doing this really quickly but those are just somer reasons off the top of my head.

 

[kama'aina mama]

Fascism.

 

[swimswamswum]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kama'aina mama Fascism.

Yup.

In addition to this I would point to two main reasons:
1) a history of extreme subjugation that is currently maintained through unequal laws/ unjust "justice" system
2) economics- there is a "prison industrial complex" that is big, big business. Prisons have largely been privatized and they are HUGE money makers. Prisons maintain economic, racial and social hierarchies- it pays to keep certain members of the public subjugated.

Now I'm all p*ssed off from thinking about this.

:

 

[hellyaellen]

a large part is the 'war' on drugs. mandatory minimumn times for certain drug related crimes. als our way of imprisoning people who dare to defy our so called morals. prostitutes, number runners, etc.

i agree that the punishements imposed often don't fit the crime commited. i really don't believe in imprisoning people for crimes not damaging to another persons body or property.

 

[annakiss]

Facism seems about right. For the previous stated reasons, mainly the war on drugs and the prison industrial complex.

 

[~member~]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swimswamswum 1) a history of extreme subjugation that is currently maintained through unequal laws/ unjust "justice" system 2) economics- there is a "prison industrial complex" that is big, big business. Prisons have largely been privatized and they are HUGE money makers. Prisons maintain economic, racial and social hierarchies- it pays to keep certain members of the public subjugated. Now I'm all p*ssed off from thinking about this. :

:

 

[JessicaS]

I removed some discussion that was swiftly about to take the thread off-topic.

 

[kelly81]

Um, my first post wasn't off topic. I was the first to answer the main question, with out wanting sources.. Why was my first post removed?

 

[Tata]

http://www.hrw.org/backgrounder/usa/race/

Key Findings:

Incarceration of Blacks

· In twelve states, between 10 and 15 percent of adult black men are incarcerated.

· In ten states, between 5 and 10 percent of black adults are incarcerated.

· In twelve states, black men are incarcerated at rates between twelve and sixteen times greater than those of white men.

· In fifteen states, black women are incarcerated at rates between ten and thirty-five times greater than those of white women.

· In six states, black youth under age eighteen are incarcerated in adult facilities at rates between twelve and twenty-five times greater than those of white youth.

Incarceration of Hispanics

· In nine states, between 4 and nearly 8 percent of adult Latino men are incarcerated.

· In twelve states, between 2 and 4 percent of Hispanic adults (men and women) are incarcerated.

· In ten states, Latino men are incarcerated at rates between five and nine times greater than those of white men.

· In eight states, Latina women are incarcerated rates that are between four and seven times greater than those of white women.

· In four states, Hispanic youth under age eighteen are incarcerated in adult facilities at rates between seven and seventeen times greater than those of white youth.

http://www.hrw.org/reports/2000/usa/
http://www.hrw.org/reports/2000/usa/Table1.pdf

Racism and fear. Our government fears its population. Any first year college history will teach that, historically, when a government begins to fear its population it resorts to more and more stringent, subversive and harsh means of control. The sad thing is is that this should be taught in at leaste eighth grade.

 

[annakiss]

I recently read that 1 in 8 prisoners worldwide is an African American male.

 

[JessicaS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kelly81 Um, my first post wasn't off topic. I was the first to answer the main question, with out wanting sources.. Why was my first post removed?

We don't discuss such things on the boards.

 

[kama'aina mama]

Quote:

Originally Posted by annakiss I recently read that 1 in 8 prisoners worldwide is an African American male.

If that is true.... wow. I'm gobsmacked.

 

[swimswamswum]

Yeah, I took an awesome sociology class during undergrad where we learned about some of the reasons for the large numbers of African American men in jail. It made me so upset- the laws for drugs are set up by racial/ ethnic groups- crack has much harsher consequences than coke.

We also talked about how racial pro-filing sets people up to be criminals.

It makes me want to hurl when I think about it.

 

[annakiss]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kama'aina mama If that is true.... wow. I'm gobsmacked.

I tried to find an online source for this, but couldn't. It may have been the authors own math after examining factsheets. Here's a great resource for information on American prisons and the inequality in them: http://www.prisonsucks.com/