I am glad she was cremated. But that is more because of my own personal beliefs than anything else (I think it is wrong to waste so much space to bury the dead). Mostly I am interested to see what the autopsy results are. I know it really isn't any of my business, but curiosity killed the cat you know. :LOL

 

Okay... this is what drives me nuts about cases like this and how they get reported.

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The Schindlers had sought to have independent medical experts observe their daughter's autopsy at the Pinellas County Medical Examiner's office, but the agency refused their request,

As far as I am concerned the ME is pretty independent. He is a public servant and unless there is some allegation of misbehavior here he has no reason not to deliver an honest and accurate report on Ms Shiavo's condition. Her parents are upset that a doctor selected by them and paid by them was not permited to be present.

I think a more honest way to describe the situation would be, "The Schindlers sought to have a medical expert sympathetic to their point of view interfering with the independant evaluation of their daughters autopsy."

Sheesh, I'll be glad when all of this is out of the news for good.

 

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Originally Posted by kama'aina mama Okay... this is what drives me nuts about cases like this and how they get reported. As far as I am concerned the ME is pretty independent. He is a public servant and unless there is some allegation of misbehavior here he has no reason not to deliver an honest and accurate report on Ms Shiavo's condition. Her parents are upset that a doctor selected by them and paid by them was not permited to be present. I think a more honest way to describe the situation would be, "The Schindlers sought to have a medical expert sympathetic to their point of view interfering with the independant evaluation of their daughters autopsy." Sheesh, I'll be glad when all of this is out of the news for good.

ITA- I was going to post the same thing, but figured this would eventually get very heated. The Schindlers are portraying Michael as this monster, but this shows that they are being pretty unreasonable, IMO.

 

It was my understanding that Micheal ordered an autopsy and they removed her brain after death.

From what the news analyst said, the human brain is too mushy to look into right after death. It has to remain in a chemical solution for at least a week before anyone can do an autopsy on it.

So was she cremated with her brain or not?

This case has left me flabbergasted at every turn. It is propaganda EVERYWHERE. Oy vey!

 

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Originally Posted by kama'aina mama I think a more honest way to describe the situation would be, "The Schindlers sought to have a medical expert sympathetic to their point of view interfering with the independant evaluation of their daughters autopsy." Sheesh, I'll be glad when all of this is out of the news for good.

Although I still dislike M Schiavo, ITA. I fail to see how any of this post-mortem hysteria serves the memory of Terri's life.

 

I felt that way about the pre-mortem hysteria, skellbelle.

 

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Originally Posted by Chanley It was my understanding that Micheal ordered an autopsy and they removed her brain after death. From what the news analyst said, the human brain is too mushy to look into right after death. It has to remain in a chemical solution for at least a week before anyone can do an autopsy on it. So was she cremated with her brain or not? This case has left me flabbergasted at every turn. It is propaganda EVERYWHERE. Oy vey!

Does that mean they normally wait a week to do an autopsy? I only know one person who was autopsied and they didn't wait that long. He wasn't known to havenything specifically wrong with his brain, but all autopsies are the same, aren't they? I don't know...

As for cremation, don't they take the organs out even when your cremated? So she wouldn't be cremated with her brain anyway. I could be wrong about that, but I think they remove all the organs anyway.

 

They don't remove organs for cremation - just metal items if possible.

The scope of the autopy varies according to the reason and the facilities available. For instance, many criminal autopsies often involve a toxicology screen. But that would not neccesarily be part of an examination of an older person who had a stroke.

Examination of the brain is usually done, but the extent is variable depending on why it's being examined and by whom. The brain can be frozen and sliced, or preserved and sectioned, etc. Some of the techniques prevent other things from being done.

I hope that Ms. Shiavo had a very complete examination that satisfies all parties. I would not be surprised if they are still awaiting more complicated test results and continuing to work on microscopy slides and sections.

 

Have you noticed that this story is completely ignored now that there's a new one to chase: the pope's death -- it's on 24/7. I don't think I can watch a week's worth of coverage of the pope's body lying in state (no disrespect intended). Less, actually, the funeral is on Friday.

 

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who were unable to have their own independent expert observe her autopsy.

Way to slander the County Medical Examiner. These people just don't know when to stop.

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Originally Posted by kama'aina mama I think a more honest way to describe the situation would be, "The Schindlers sought to have a medical expert sympathetic to their point of view interfering with the independant evaluation of their daughters autopsy."

 

I too am extremely curious (morbidly?) about the autopsy results. This poor woman's family sounds like they believe there was some conspiracy to murder their daughter.

I wonder what will happen if the autopsy results vindicate Mr. Schiavo (is that the right word?) and show once and for all that this woman was functioning as a shell of a human.

I am also curious as to how long he will wait before he married his fiance. I have a feeling no matter how long he waits, it will not be long enough for the finger-waggers.

On another note, my husband and I are now doing our living wills and health care directives and are talking in detail about what kind of conditions we are and are not willing to live in. We found a great form on agingwithdignity.org that is very detailed about how you want to be treated at the end of your life.

 

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Terry's folks wanted an independent autopsy done and with good reason

this was an independent autopsy.

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I've refused to take sides in this (even though I totally disagreed with how Terry was allowed to die and I think Michael should have divorced her before he "married" again and had children). That is not the point now.

Sounds like you have taken sides to me.

I agree with those that said that this will not end the craziness that her parents have displayed. NOTHING will make them happy. If the results are not what they want, they will sue the county for refusing their doctor (probably that guy that is not qualified in this field of medicine).

V

 

NM... I think I mostly agree with you. I don't find anyone in this family particularly likeable or even noble....

 

While I absolutely agree that the Schindlers have taken things too far at this point, I don't doubt that I would do the exact same thing. The emotional grief over the loss of my child would make me do crazy things, I'm sure of it. I know I would be nearly insane after watching my daughter starve to death.

 

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Originally Posted by skellbelle I know I would be nearly insane after watching my daughter starve to death.

 

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Originally Posted by skellbelle While I absolutely agree that the Schindlers have taken things too far at this point, I don't doubt that I would do the exact same thing. The emotional grief over the loss of my child would make me do crazy things, I'm sure of it. I know I would be nearly insane after watching my daughter starve to death.

ITA.

 

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Originally Posted by Nursing Mother why the rolling eyes?

OK, now I feel up to answering this (faux-shock and all).

1) Terri's parents lost her years and years ago, whether or not they were able to accept that reality.

2) And several people here who have personally witnessed hospice deaths of people in PVS' have already said that starvation is, in fact, a fairly peaceful and gentle way for those people to finally go (a point which has been totally ignored by those here who are already all hysterical from rightwing propaganda about the case instead of facts).

Therefore,

3) I feel that Skellbelle's description of "watching [her] daughter starve to death" was a manipulative, emotional-appeal picture to paint of some poor suffering person begging for food and being denied it. The fact that she and you have fallen for it does not mean the rest of us should.

Thus the rolling eyes.

 

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Originally Posted by girlndocs I feel that Skellbelle's description of "watching [her] daughter starve to death" was a manipulative, emotional-appeal picture to paint of some poor suffering person begging for food and being denied it. The fact that she and you have fallen for it does not mean the rest of us should.

You are wrong.

It is the emotional picture of a MOTHER being forced to watch her CHILD die and being powerless to stop it. Period.

That would not affect you, as a mother????????

I cannot get over how cold and cruel a bunch of supposedly AP parents have been in regard to this case.

Terri was starved to death....the fact that she was unable to "beg for food" does not negate that. If starvation is such a peaceful, gentle way to go, then why did Terri require morphine in her last days of life?

 

It was a CYA measure.

Let's not get back into debating the disgusting pre-death circus, this thread is supposed to be about the disgusting post-death circus, remember?

 

i am sure we will all agree that a quality of life is an important part of life but i would not want to be the one to have to make a decission unless every road had been traveled. what would it have hurt to do the scan on her brain before pulling the tube out? its one test. it would have taken minutes to perform and would have shown and put many people at rest with the decision that was made. what if it shows that there was no activity ... then everyone would see that it was for the best. but what if it would have shown that there was activity and they were correct? how is EVERYONE going to feel when it the autopsy comes back? what if she was without activity..will we feel it was ok....what if there was movement are we going to feel this was ok....my only problem is that there was not a living will and that before they did this they did not perform a simple procedure...we all have to follow someones wishes but they are in writing...if it were me without that piece of paper i would have wanted that test done...then i would feel i was doing what was best....its just a thought

 

Am agreeing with k'a'mama, will be totally relieved not to hear about this anymore.

Mostly because now that it's over, my views on it are ... evolving ...

 

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Originally Posted by thinkaboutit i am sure we will all agree that a quality of life is an important part of life but i would not want to be the one to have to make a decission unless every road had been traveled. what would it have hurt to do the scan on her brain before pulling the tube out? its one test. it would have taken minutes to perform and would have shown and put many people at rest with the decision that was made. what if it shows that there was no activity ... then everyone would see that it was for the best. but what if it would have shown that there was activity and they were correct? how is EVERYONE going to feel when it the autopsy comes back? what if she was without activity..will we feel it was ok....what if there was movement are we going to feel this was ok....my only problem is that there was not a living will and that before they did this they did not perform a simple procedure...we all have to follow someones wishes but they are in writing...if it were me without that piece of paper i would have wanted that test done...then i would feel i was doing what was best....its just a thought

there is another thread in the same area of mothering that talks about this more, but they couldn't do the scan because of the treatments that she received left metal in her head. They did do another type of scan that showed that her brain had replaced brain matter with spinal fluid.

 

Thank you Victorian. I am tired of all the misconceptions about this case.