No real advice, just commiseration. I did everything "right" by GD standards when they were toddlers/young preschoolers: no punishing/time outs, using redirecting/distraction, honoring the impulse, explaining, saying yes and mutually agreeable solutiong as much as I was capable, etc. etc. - and for a long time, it worked really really well, and they were a joy to be around at home and out in public. But, in the last 6 months-year or so, my 6-1/2 yo DS is really giving us the business (and of course his 4 yo sister is copying him). I just keep on keepin' on and try to maintain calm - sometimes I'm able to, other times I holler. Sigh. We have LOTS of conversations about respect and listening and cooperating (for all of us, not just them), and some days are great......others, not as much. I think a lot of it has to do with autonomy and growing up, so I'm just remaining consistent with the expectations, and hoping that maturity will bring things back down to a reasonable level in the coming year or two. We ahve been using logical consequences recently, because negotiating and explaining things just isn't working at this point, and without the logical consequences there is quite literally chaos in the house, screaming, running around, carrying on until someone gets hurt, etc. They are VERY energetic kids without a lot of impulse control still, so there have to be some boundaries. Believe me, I didn't want to parent this way, I was never punished as a kid, but I actually listened and was reasonable with my parents so there was never a need. After asking and explaining a couple times and getting no response or flat out refusal (and/or refusal to compromise), I am at my wit's end and wind up giving a logical consequence just so nobody gets hurt, nothing gets wrecked, and I don't lose my marbles. "This too shall pass" is a phrase that runs through my mind a LOT lately.

 

Yep, I am right there with you sister. I get the feeling from talking to my mom that my kids are really intense and difficult compared to me and my siblings. I don't know if it is true or not, but I sure do feel like my kids are TOUGH! Sometimes I think it would just be so much easier if I could just send them outside to play in the woods. I feel like if they could do that, things would be a lot better. Unfortunately, its not possible right now. But that is what we did as kids, and I think it saved my mom. It feels like my kids and I are always too much in each others space or something, kwim?
Thanks for the commiseration. Good luck with yours too. I hope it gets easier.

 

 

I try to emphasize respect. I talk about it often when they don't show it and when they do, giving positive reinforcement. I also try to show it to them and to my husband so they see it demonstrated. I think they pick up a lot yucky behaviors at school though. Like the spitting and saying shut up. And I guess the fact that they are not afraid I will spank them, makes them more likely to say shut up to me. I guess it just takes maturity and impulse control on their part for some of these behaviors to end.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by catinthehat She knows nothing really bad is going to happen to her, so she just does whatever she wants.

Why is that? I have a 4 year old and he knows well that the fun stops if he acts that way.

 

I don't know. Any suggestions?

 

Can you give us examples of the consequences you currently impose? Or are there are literally no consequences when she behaves that way? (you mention yelling and threatening but what is the actual 'cost' to her?).

In this house that would get an immediate cool down time. A long talk and whatever fun event(s) we had planned for the rest of the day would be canceled. Immediately. No negotiations.

I'm talking specifically about flicking the watermelon juice and spitting at you. Yelling at her sister I'd have a higher tolerance for because it seems more run of the mill (a consequence, sure but not as severe).

 

I think you can find ways to reinforce without punishing. If my DD spit in my face there would be nothing fun happening all. day. long. Likewise, she has said "shut up" to me because her FATHER (XP) lets her talk like that. I sat them down, XP and DD, and said i respected his right to discipline her in his home but that "shut up" is NOT going to be tolerated in my home and she needs to remember that. My hope was that he would realise his "fun" time teaching her appalling ways was only costing her in the long term, but he seems to be perfectly happy to let her suffer in fact, so

. She's getting better at remembering.

 

I do try to use some logical consequences, but my dd is really tough because she doesn't really "care" about much of anything. She enjoys being in her room alone, so a "cool down" time doesn't work as a punishment. It would work as a cool down time, but it is not going to keep her from doing the behavior the next time. She is not attached to t.v., seeing friends, going out and doing things, etc. The only thing that really is a big deal to her is if her sister gets something she doesn't get. However, I think using that route just creates more jealousy between the two.
I said before that she doesn't want to please me. Well, that is probably not completely true. She does often try to do the right thing. However, if she feels she has been wronged in some way, or that something isn't fair, she will react really strongly by doing these kind of rude behaviors.
When she does something like saying shut up, I get visibly upset with her and say, "we don't talk to people like that in our family. It is rude and hurtful..." Then I usually send her to her room for a while.
I just feel like negative consequences really don't work with her. It works much better to always use positive reinforcement with her instead of punishment. She is really stubborn, and once she gets on the "wrong track", it is nearly impossible to get back on the right track. Don't know if that makes sense, but I just have a hard time with her because she seems to not "care" about anything, including upsetting me most of the time.

 

It sounds to me like you are blessed with a certain kind of child - similar to my own dd although since she is an only child I suspect we don't get as many behaviors - GD is definitely easier to apply with just ONE

I say similar b/c anytime she is corrected/disciplined in a strong authoritarian manner she usually gets defiant/oppositional and sometimes just tries to say the most hurtful thing she can come up with.

I find Playful Parenting to really be the most effective approach with her - it's very difficult sometimes to do (esp for dh) but the outcome is always better then the authoritarian stance. If you haven't read it I highly recommend it - it talks about the root of misbehavior being a result of either a lack of power/control or a lack of connection - fill these "cups" and you have much better behaved children.

 

I am going through a similar phase with DD, 5. Here's what I think:

It's worse now because it's summer time and her routine is all changed up.
It's worse now because she's getting less rest than during the school year.
It's worse now because she's had a lingering cold and cough and she feels a little crappy.

We were on vacation last week, but before that I started 'quiet time' in her room for an hour every afternoon. I think she needs some time to just unwind. That seems to help.

I am hoping once we get into school in the fall, that new routine will fall into place and that will help.

And then with the rudeness--I feel your pain--it is just one day at a time there. DD does not like to be corrected and will turn something simple like a request to rephrase a demand into a big battle. It's exhausting. I try to talk to her about being polite during quiet, pleasant moments and catch when she uses her good manners and praise her. And I am really just hoping for a big leap in maturity, soon, as well.

It also helps to look back at negative behaviors that have gone away, and realize that these should pass as well.